Euphonium intonation tendencies

[dreamofoenghus]

I’m trying to determine if I’m completely nuts, or if it’s possible that it’s not just me….

I have two 4-valve, in-line, non-compensating euphoniums; a Conn 19i (same as king 2280) and a Willson 2704. Both are great instruments, though clearly different. They work great for a tuba guy that just doesn’t feel comfortable with the 3+1 thing. I tend to have the same issue on both. I can’t seem to get the 2nd valve pitches high enough. A and E particularly, but other pitches in that overtone series as well. If I’ve got the mts set pretty in-tune, and #2 slide all the way in, 2nd valve pitches are flat. Flat enough that it’s tough to lip some of them up. Is this a known issue for anyone else or on any horns in particular? Or is it that I’m simply 2nd valve incompetent?

[bloke]

Making the number 2 circuit too long was a way to sort of “compensate“ without the Blaikley compensating system.
With the fourth partial being flat on those models, the pitch, A, is highlighted as being even lower.

[jtm]

I had assumed it was a compromise, as bloke said, so that 2-3 and 2-4 aren't much too sharp. My (also 4 valve, non-compensated) Yamaha 321 and 1929 Holton (thanks, Joe!) are the same way.

I notice it a lot less if I'm playing with a group where there are other different instruments to match and I'm less likely to just let the instrument do what it naturally does.

[bloke]

It also "helps" 1-2.

Individual circuits (ignoring acoustical not-in-tune-with-equal-temperament issues) - if NO compromises - are all tuned to lower a 9-foot expanding bugle by either a semitone, a whole tone, or a minor third.

As soon as TWO circuits are COMBINED, the mathematical ratios become screwed up...thus this - et al - attempts at "outrunning" those inescapable math issues.