Miraphone 186 at Taylor Music

[DonO.]

“Reconditioned” 186-4U BBb at Taylor ready for immediate shipping with free shipping! According to them, their best overhaul. All dents and scratches removed, re-lacquered, NEW bell, nickel silver leadpipe, finger paddles, and linkages, all genuine Miraphone parts. $6450 seems like a great price for this if you’re in the market for one. I make the assumption that it’s an ex-school horn. School use would explain the necessity for a new bell.

[Three Valves]

So would destroyed in shipping.

Bell replaced = should be more than 1500 off. (To me)

Talk about "used" I mean, that's USED!!

[hrender]

So would destroyed in shipping.

Bell replaced = should be more than 1500 off. (To me)

Talk about "used" I mean, that's USED!!

"all genuine Miraphone parts" justifies a higher price than one that had a clone bell as a replacement. That said, BBC has a couple of older 186s for less.

[DonO.]

True, you can find them brand new for 8100 if you look at the right store. It’s more common to find them selling for closer to 8700. Miraphone brand always seems to have a premium attached, even used. I’ve seen 4000 or even 5000 asked for even beat up examples. Of course “asking’ ain’t gettin’”.

[Three Valves]

I looked at it again since getting my second tuba from them/Taylor.

It is more like $1700 less than not previously damaged new.

Shipping is included and sales tax in your non tax-free state may be avoided.

These are several hundred dollar considerations in addition to selling price.

If my budget and conscience allowed....

[bloke]

I'll agree that it's a great price when I see someone pay that.
At that time, I'll jack my re-lacquered 186 pricing up to that amount.
That having been said, if I spent $1800 bucks for a new bell and new mouthpipe + shipping to blokeplace + $400 - $500 For a trashed 86, I’d probably need that same amount of money to strip it, straighten it all out, un-fubar the valves, buff, and lacquer it…
… but I would sort of assume that no one would pay that for one brought back from the dead, and would probably prefer to pay another $1500 to $2000 for a new one (school bid).

[jtm]

… but I would sort of assume that no one would pay that for one brought back from the dead, and would probably prefer to pay another $1500 to $2000 for a new one (school bid).

Maybe they really like those sheet metal bows...

[DonO.]

Most individuals do not have access to “school bid” pricing. When I was teaching some retailers that specialize in school bid instrument sales would give a “school price” on a personal instrument to a teacher as a courtesy. But most people just have to pay retail. I simply thought a refurbished Miraphone for 6400 was a good buy compared with 8700 plus shipping for a new one. Now Bloke, if you’re saying you would sell that refurb for 4000, that would pique my interest!

[bloke]

Taylor sells a lot of stuff to schools.
You might notice that - browsing their website - you don’t see a lot of “boutique-y” stuff.

Most school systems don’t allow putting out bids for used things, because the quality will be unequal, and thus the bidding will be unequal, so when schools’ bands buy used, it has to be done by band parent organizations.

Again, this particular pricing is in the cracks, because it looks to me like mo’ money than most band parent organizations will cough up easily, but too close to school bid pricing (as music stores are probably glad to only make a few hundred bucks on something like that, as long as they never have to touch it with their own hands - and with the knowledge that the buyer is not going to be some “hears the grass grow“ artiste who is going to ask to return it).

I have a brand spanking new decades-old 16.5” 186 bell (absolutely NOT for sale), and I have two or three 186 instruments with mostly good valves (along with some good spare complete valve assemblies laying around) and ruined bells, but the reason I haven’t done anything with this bell (combined with one of those carcasses) is that I would probably have to offer such an instrument for the same price as Taylor is asking, and I just don’t think there would be any takers. Further - with hyperinflation in place, that ask-price price would necessarily need to rise - as it remained unsold. As we’ve all seen, fast food joints are now having to pay $15/hour to hire the same addicts (etc.) that they hired a couple of years ago at $7.50/hour… and they can’t even find enough of them to staff their places at this new double amount. We can all pretend that inflation rates are only the little bit that they claim on TV, but we all see the gasoline, used cars, houses, food, etc. are all epically higher (percentage-wise) than claimed by gov’t people (and their media shills) sitting behind podiums and desks.

You yourself admit that your level of interest - in a Miraphone tuba such as this - is stuck at the $4000 price point, and (though that selling price might have motivated me ten years ago) that’s not enough to (as our currency is virtually worthless) motivate me … nor – obviously – Taylor.

Finally, budget-quality new instruments and repaired/refinished old instruments are sold from their shiny pictures. Shiny/“rebuilt” instruments might or might not have valves and linkage that would delight us, just as budget new ones might or might not. (That having been said, I have had professionals bring in their $XX,XXX Instruments merely to have a dent removed, with the valve action being absolutely horrible, so I guess all sorts of players’ levels of tolerance varies vastly.)
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This post is long, and it might seem as though I was triggered and this is some sort of a screed, but - truth be told - there are a lot of things to consider regarding these sorts of issues, and I’m actually just sitting here eating some breakfast and waiting for something - so I can continue on with what I was doing… thus: all of this typing on my phone into this text box.

[DonO.]

Great post bloke! Covers a lot of ground and gives us much to think about. When I was still teaching it is true that we could only bid out new, but if booster groups give a director carte blanche to spend their money on whatever he or she wants, then that’s where Taylor Music (and others) overhauls would come into play. As far as the valves go, they say it’s a complete overhaul, so I would expect the valves to have been worked on. But you pays your money and you takes your chances. Anytime you purchase any instrument used- serviced, overhauled, refurb, or just “gently used”, it’s a leap of faith and also potential problems.

[bloke]

I completely shy away from buying “complete overhauls“ (at least, from pictures), just as I shy away from buying used tubas that look really nice - yet, have had the lacquer removed from their entire bell sections.

That having been said, I’m selling a model (1)84 Miraphone with a replacement (used) bell - a bell from which I removed the distressed lacquer and am replacing its lacquer… but I did not sand and buff the crap out of that bell (in order to hide old repair marks), and the person buying it knows that.

I guess I’m trying to say that my mentality – when I repair things for sale – might be a little bit different from the mentality of some “overhaul shops”.

the Taylor Music tuba:
It may well be REALLY nice, but I think I would prefer to take a look at it in person first.
It would be quite a drive (from here) to go up there to look at it, but round-trip shipping would be quite expensive (not to mention the nuisance to both parties) as well.

[Three Valves]

As far as the valves go, they say it’s a complete overhaul, so I would expect the valves to have been worked on.

If serious, I'd just ask Taylor.

I only suspect those valves are practically new.

The only justification for the price would be serious shipping damage of new or practically new horn requiring bell and linkage replacement.

[Three Valves]

The “reconditioned” new one sold.

A new, new one is still $8,150 shipping included.

[bloke]

If it was new (with a shipping-trashed bell), I would have expected that only its replacement bell would have received new lacquer...but whatever.

Many ten/twenty/thirty-year old ones' valves are still quite fine.

It sold, so obviously it was not overpriced.