Painful memory from my youth

[windshieldbug]

Having been through many job interviews at my place of employment (all promotions have to go through a formal interview process), I can tell you that there is usually a question that’s meant to make most people stumble, and possibly one other to make unqualified people show themselves as obviously unqualified.

The 8vb sight read was likely just a chance to separate candidates at a slightly higher level than basic acceptable proficiency.

The real kicker is that you don’t know the quality of auditions that the tuba professor saw that year. There might’ve been only a spot or two to fill, and you ranked 3 or 4.

Based on my career experience, where the interviews are like auditions*, I can tell you that it’s not worth worrying about in hindsight, since it only takes one unknown candidate to blow everyone else out of the water. As such, I’ve learned to let this stuff go. But alas, I’m also not 18 now…

I remember one audition I had for a grad school slot. I was kinda prepared, but not really. I got decent feedback after the audition, but the delivery of said feedback was such that I was kinda glad I didn’t get in. Things worked out fine in the end anyhow (also a “STEM” worker after various career and academic meanderings).





*There’s a list of questions for these interviews where one has 20 or so minutes prior to the interview to read and sketch out responses with which they then have to answer live in front of the committee. The committee has the resume and application in hand as well, and expects the work experience to be woven through these questions while answering the questions satisfactorily. The real secret to success is to take a few interviews as prep, talk to people that know the process, dry run several mock interviews, have extra material ready to go at the drop of a hat, and expect follow-up questions and/or a second round if 2/3 candidates are close. So yeah, just like an audition. And the goal is to be that guy/gal that is obviously head and shoulders above the rest.

[Mary Ann]

Interesting....you must have worked for a very large company where people didn't know each other. As an engineer I worked in a public utility with a total workforce of 1500. So there were not that many engineers; basically, when a job opened up, when people put in for it, it was pretty much decided before the interviews happened who was going to get the job. I remember withdrawing from one application before the interview, and the HR lady said, "Are you SURE you want to withdraw? Are you SURE?" -- because I already had the job. I"m glad I withdrew too, for the record. I was better off where I was.

[kingrob76]

Yes, if you walked into a college audition - even in the 1970's - and were handed a piece of bass clef music for trombone you would have been expected to play it. I can understand if it was tenor clef but if it was bass clef it's a reasonable expectation. Also reasonable would have been to attempt to play it - either in the printed range, or the intended range. An e-flat below the staff is the same fingering as an e-flat above the staff.

When you walk into ANY audition room you - or job interview - the people conducting the process have a minuscule window to determine if you are someone capable of handling the work ahead of you (or excelling at the work ahead of you). If they have more applicants than positions the conversation shifts to NOT giving them reasons to remove you from consideration. ANY reason can be enough to rule out a candidate. Is that fair? Who cares. It's reality, fairness isn't in the building and is never part of the conversation.

The very simple truth becomes if you didn't get <whatever the spot or job is> it's because you weren't good enough. That happens every. single. day. And by the way, there's nothing wrong with not being good enough no matter the reason that is the case. It means you need to get better or find something else.

There's SO much whining and bellyaching about "unfair auditions", how "so-and-so was automatically advanced to the finals" or whatever. How do you think so-and-so GOT to that spot? They were good enough and worked hard to maximize their potential. Very, very few humans - in my experience - maximize their potential at something. There are a hundred or more reasons why this is the case, but it only takes one for that maximum potential to not be achieved.

Being critical of and honest with one's self has a TON of value, not just in trying to reach that potential but in everything we do.

[DonO.]

Ouch! Rob! Very harsh! Did you read all of the other posts? Mostly, I wanted to know if being able to read trombone music an octave down was a reasonable expectation to have for a high school tuba player. And, the flip side, was I reasonable in expecting to be given tuba music to sight read, given that I was a tuba player? I freely admitted that I was isolated from others in the tuba scene and had no idea what was going on with other players in other parts of the country. Sight reading is tough. There is a lot to get right, lots of potential stumbling blocks. My feeling at the time was that it wasn’t right to add on octave transposition. And, in reply to a previous post, yes, an octave up or down IS transposition. Look it up. Transposition is moving any note from its previous spot to a new spot. It’s doesn’t have to be a new key signature. It just seemed weird to me. Do trumpet players get French horn sight reading? Do saxophonists get oboe sight reading? No. They get sight reading written specifically for their instrument. And I thought I was reasonable in expecting the same. Which is why I’m glad I started this discussion, because I discovered through the responses that I was WRONG. Apparently, tuba players reading trombone music is a “thing”. And 50 years ago I didn’t realize that. Please understand, my intention was not to “bellyache”. I mean, this was almost 50 years ago. And things turned out just fine for me, thank you. And as I’ve lived my life I’ve had my share of failures and disappointments, as well as some successes. It’s just that I always had this thing in the back of my mind that what happened to me wasn’t right. And until I joined this group I never had a group of peers to discuss this with. So let me say it one more time. I GET IT. I WAS YOUNG AND IGNORANT. HE WAS RIGHT.

[matt g]

Interesting....you must have worked for a very large company where people didn't know each other. As an engineer I worked in a public utility with a total workforce of 1500. So there were not that many engineers; basically, when a job opened up, when people put in for it, it was pretty much decided before the interviews happened who was going to get the job. I remember withdrawing from one application before the interview, and the HR lady said, "Are you SURE you want to withdraw? Are you SURE?" -- because I already had the job. I"m glad I withdrew too, for the record. I was better off where I was.

Where I currently work employs ~4,000 people onsite with about 50% holding STEM degrees, most of them engineers of some variety, then computer scientists, along with other supporting mathematicians, physicists, biologists, etc as needed.

There is a good chance people may not know each other and the interview system is mandated from well above.

[djwpe]

As for ego, life beat mine out of me long ago. Perhaps some of you know what I mean.

In my industry (commercial construction) it was a rite of passage for many of us to have taken our beatings and grow from the experience. And by beatings I mean consequences for mistakes. These days, it seems that there are fewer beatings, and as such, a lower quality of manager.

I’ve been working recently with a young guy who’s been an anointed superstar, and has never taken a beating, and his ego is much bigger than his actual ability.

[Mark]

Mostly, I wanted to know if being able to read trombone music an octave down was a reasonable expectation to have for a high school tuba player.

Where I went to high school, yes. We, tuba players, were regularly given string bass or trombone parts and expected to play them down an octave.