Does this mouthpiece exist?

[DonO.]

I like my Helleberg standard on my King 2341, but my new to me Kanstul 3/4 sounds better with my Helleberg 7B. However I dislike the wider rim on the 7B. I would love to find a mouthpiece that has the same cup and throat as the 7B but with a rim that is narrower, more like the standard. What am I shopping for?

[bloke]

Maybe (??) something that I prototyped and tested, and am now am discussing production with someone capable of cranking out a bunch of them for me.
(I'm not a big Helleberg fan, but that's one of my biggest gripes with most of the various Helleberg things is their rim contours...and I addressed it in this prototype, which features my most popular rim contour - a narrow one.)

I was sort of waiting to talk about it - in the retail forum - until I had yet ANOTHER prototype (more of a cimbasso or F tuba mouthpiece) also tested out. I really don't like testing them when they are raw brass, and the second one is off being plated.

... so watch that forum, and I'll probably go into fairly extensive detail about both of those mouthpieces along with what I need to charge to purchase one from the first batch runs of each one.

(Both of these will be one piece silver plated brass.)

[donn]

If you can find a Conn 2 tuba mouthpiece, you will find it quite similar but with a narrower, more rounded rim. In my experience with a couple of them, it sounds a little "darker" than the 7B, but I suppose one can expect some individual variation. Later they made some with a kind of weird exterior but (I think) the same interior, with model number 1792-2; if you find one for sale, that number probably won't be mentioned, but it's worth looking it up to see what they look like.

The Faxx 7B's rim isn't so rounded, but it is of ordinary width. To my eye, its "flat" surface is really tilted inwards a bit, which I think is a nice touch.

Considering that they're all just about the same as their ancestor Conn Helleberg of a century ago, this formula is probably the most successful mouthpiece ever, and a Conn 2 in good shape is a good example.

[JESimmons]

Doug Elliott has Helleburg style cups and a number of rims.

[bloke]

This is the "Helleberg 2" style (more like the really old Helleberg mouthpieces) mouthpiece that I've been monkeying with as a prototype to possibly offer as a new model (again: silver plated brass/one-piece/no options).

You can see where the lathe cutting stopped (see arrow) where my (again: most popular) #2 profile rim was superimposed, ridding the mouthpiece of the typical "Helleberg 2" rim contour (which I personally don't care for).

I didn't monkey with the throat, but I did alter the overall back-bore to offer a default slightly-less-bright sonic characteristic.
(That characteristic remains, but is a bit tempered.)

Again:
Once I get the other (possibly also marketing) very shallow bowl mouthpiece plated/tested (my use: cimbasso / others: possibly F tuba, cimbasso, and whatever), I hope to offer a discounted price on "first run" of each of these possible new models. (The very shallow bowl one also features a #2 profile rim - the smallest embouchure opening 32.3mm version.)

As can be seen on this closeup of the "Helleberg 2" prototype, my #2 profile rim (which was cut onto this mouthpiece post-manufacture) is narrower than most rims on most marketed tuba mouthpieces and features an asymmetrical (slants away from the players face on the outside edge) profile. The asymmetrical contour allows the rim to feel like even less than it is - without any sort of "cookie-cutter" sensation. This is the only rim profile (me: with three different inside diameters) that I personally use. I can play on this rim profile (again: I personally use three different embouchure openings with this same contour - ie. three "donut hole" sizes - and can play for hours-and-hours on this contour without soreness nor blisters forming on my skin.)

If these go into production, obviously those making them for me will use infinitely nicer equipment than what's here in my modest shop.



I'm hoping to get the "cimbasso" prototype (not pictured) silver plated by February 10th, because I'll be playing cimbasso wall-too-wall from the 10th through the 12th.
My Solo cup (with the same rim and small-shank #0 throat/backbore) works well with my cimbasso (when covering parts labeled "tuba", but which work better with cimbasso), but I'm looking for something which helps out a bit more (well) above the staff, as I'm finding myself covering bass 'bone parts with this contraption with some frequency.

[hrender]

There are a lot of smaller Helleberg ‘pieces. If you can find a Floyd Cooley mouthpiece you might get just what you want, but they’re rare. Some of the Warburton “The Grail” series would be another option. A cheaper thing to try would be a used Schilke 66. All of these are supposedly based on an older, smaller original Helleberg, like the 7B.

[kingrob76]

I like my Helleberg standard on my King 2341, but my new to me Kanstul 3/4 sounds better with my Helleberg 7B. However I dislike the wider rim on the 7B. I would love to find a mouthpiece that has the same cup and throat as the 7B but with a rim that is narrower, more like the standard. What am I shopping for?

Try the Doug Elliott stuff - a TU N128FLAT rim on a N or P cup should be really close. Doug is one of the nicest guys you'll ever talk to and a quick phone call to him will allow him to steer you quickly to a good match. Doug's stuff is all modular so if you like that rim you could slap it on a number of cups.

[donn]

A cheaper thing to try would be a used Schilke 66.

Great mouthpiece, for me it seems a little smaller in diameter than the 7B. My Schilke 67 is a little larger than the 7B and plays like a very deep mouthpiece.

[bloke]

Just as much as my post is self-promoting ("bloke is just trying to promote/sell his new stuff to us"),

several of the other posts (based on recommendations) are off-topic:

...dislike the wider rim... // ...but with a rim that is narrower.

The Elliott recommendation (assuming there are some remarkably narrow rim choices in his array) is actually on-topic.

[iiipopes]

Try a blokepiece Imperial with the Helleberg 32.6 rim, or maybe another one of his rims. I played that for several years, and it is close if not identical to what you are describing what you are looking for. If later you want it deeper, you can get either/or/both the rim in blokes profundo version or get a spacer and modify it to fine tune your preferred depth.