Tried two BBb ZO Thunderbirds today...

[pjv]

...because they were there. I've never gotten into the York 6/4 copy thing because it just never presented itself. I'm also not really in the market for a 6/4 tuba.
On the other hand, a contrabass tuba where the manufacturer has pulled out all the stops on is most often a large orchestra tuba. A fantastic tuba will be tempting in any size.

Anyway, the plus points: very free blowing in all registers. High notes, low notes. All very easy to play with very little effort.
Really good intonation. I didn't have to pull for anything except pedal C&B. Not that all notes were spot on, just that any lipping was effortless and brainless. Build quality was better than expected. Also the difference between the two tubas was subtle but nothing major.

OK, except that the slides on one of the tubas were a lot much better aligned.

Which brings us to the downside: compression. The hissing when pulling on a slide with the valve up was really weak, with almost no "plop" once the valve was pressed. (Compared to the 497 there which gave a nice healthy plop even after seconds of waiting before pressing the valve).

Was it the valves leaking or the slides? (or a little of both)? Who knows.

And some minor things: Only one water key. 4th valve was really sharp requiring at least 6 inches of pull. (I hope for ZO that I was the problem and not the tuba). Lastly I prefer vented valves.

Then again, I never would have noticed the leakage if they were vented.

So if Zo just fixes the compression thing then they will definitely have a tuba which will give other companies a run for their money.
Literally. These are cheap.

[bloke]

probably a slide circuit solder joint...and easily-findable.

That having been said, that's why (along with much easier cosmetic recovery if an accident) I tend to shy away from silver plated instruments.

Lacquer can be pieced back in. Silver really cannot (at least, not very well).

I've ALREADY changed SO VERY MANY things on my (lacquer finish) model 98 Miraphone (and more slated), I would have absolutely trashed the finish - had it been silver plated.

[pjv]

If it’s a slide circuit joint then it’s on all 5 valves.
And easy to trace if you know what to look for.
Which I don’t.
At €5500 a drop that’s not expensive but still too much for a gamble.
I’d rather spend more on something I know will work. Most “6/4” tubas are about 1/4 more than I’m looking anyway.
Pity.

[bloke]

I don't really understand why it would be a problem with all five valves, but maybe we are talking past each other. Leaks like that can be found by listening, using smoke, or using water. There's also a somewhat expensive machine that some of us own that can test for leaks on wind instruments. That having been said, that expensive machine is really only good for indicating leaks, and not so much good for finding them.

For you personally, if that type of instrument is not what you're looking for anyway, the issue is moot. Were it that I owned one or two tubas, I don't believe that either one of them would be a really large B-flat, but - seeing as I own a few more, and I'm hired to play in some fairly diverse situations - I'm having fun with one, it's offering me a new tuba-playing rabbit hole, prompting some smiles from me - when I hear some recordings of concerts posted on youtube hearing the results of my own efforts sounding different from the way they have sounded in the past), and helping to keep this tuba playing stuff interesting - after well over a half century of it.

' was only specifically commenting on the likely cause of a valve circuit not being able to support somewhat of a vacuum for a reasonable number of seconds.

[UncleBeer]

Leaks like that can be found by listening, using smoke, or using water.

Plug the main tuning slide, blow in to the mouthpiece, and have a helper spray soapy water everywhere you suspect might be leaking. The bubbles give you the answer.

[Three Valves]

I hope to get close to one Friday!

[bloke]

I hope to get close to one Friday!

I thought about going up there and not displaying, though possibly carrying some mouthpieces. The thing is that I have stuff to do, and every year it's always a worrisome game to play with the icy roads.

I recall coming home one time with a rental car, and being quite concerned that eventually I might get stuck right out on Interstate 40 (as the ice and snow was beginning to come up to the underside of our car) even though I was already back down in Tennessee. But I was extremely lucky and encountered a snow plow, and was able to follow that snow plow for about 50 miles until the ice and snow turned to rain.

Even before that on that same trip home at night, I was dealing with at least 3 in of snow pack in the southern very hilly portion of Virginia in the area just before Interstate 81 goes into Tennessee.

[pjv]

I don't really understand why it would be a problem with all five valves, but maybe we are talking past each other. Leaks like that can be found by listening, using smoke, or using water. There's also a somewhat expensive machine that some of us own that can test for leaks on wind instruments. That having been said, that expensive machine is really only good for indicating leaks, and not so much good for finding them.

For you personally, if that type of instrument is not what you're looking for anyway, the issue is moot. Were it that I owned one or two tubas, I don't believe that either one of them would be a really large B-flat, but - seeing as I own a few more, and I'm hired to play in some fairly diverse situations - I'm having fun with one, it's offering me a new tuba-playing rabbit hole, prompting some smiles from me - when I hear some recordings of concerts posted on youtube hearing the results of my own efforts sounding different from the way they have sounded in the past), and helping to keep this tuba playing stuff interesting - after well over a half century of it.

' was only specifically commenting on the likely cause of a valve circuit not being able to support somewhat of a vacuum for a reasonable number of seconds.

Haha maybe we are talking past each other.
I pulled all 5 valve slides out about 2 inches, individually, without pressing the valves.
Most new tubas of quality will suck that slide right back in.of the slides are “rough” then they won’t get sucked in but you’ll hear a very healthy plop when the valve is finally pressed. I assume that this all means that there’s no leakage, creating a strong vacuum.

These tubas just gave out a ssss when I pulled the slides, and rather weak at that. So something’s not right.

So I didn’t buy the horn. I don’t need it either.
If it didn’t have this problem I would have purchased it, just to take the time to experience what this horn is. Like I mentioned, they both played REAL easy and in tune. That’s a great place to start off if buying a horn.

Leaks and all, it made a massive sound. The guy at the shop played it next to a Fasolet

[bloke]

got it

[Doc]

Leaks and all, it made a massive sound. The guy at the shop played it next to a Fasolet

Like a Chevrolet, but much bigger.

Doc (only funnin' )