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I don't understand how a horn can have such mixed reviews. Where's Siskel and Ebert?

Siskel, Ebert, and Roper all would say to buy the damn thing.

I chose to buy, try, and then decide. There's a limit to what you'll learn until you just try it. Trust me, I get the questions and it's all good stuff to know. But there's always something not perfect, and you've got to realize what's more good than bad to decide whether to stay or switch. And really, if you're rolling the dice to find something better. Or, just get bored and want to spice things up.

Yes @Three Valves I'm still talking about tubas. :)

bort2.0 wrote: ↑Sat Oct 09, 2021 6:50 pm Siskel, Ebert, and Roper all would say to buy the damn thing.

I chose to buy, try, and then decide. There's a limit to what you'll learn until you just try it. Trust me, I get the questions and it's all good stuff to know. But there's always something not perfect, and you've got to realize what's more good than bad to decide whether to stay or switch. And really, if you're rolling the dice to find something better. Or, just get bored and want to spice things up.

Yes @Three Valves I'm still talking about tubas. :)

Yeah, I still think there's a perfect horn...it's just that I am always "looking" and poking around where I shouldn't be, like the deep delving Google searches to see who is selling what. Honestly the last King had a lot of flaws (to me) I couldn't live with but the playability almost erased them all. Almost..

OK… i’ll contradict my own review:
I don’t like most of them, because they are usually all dented up, dirty, tarnished brown, smell like band rooms, and their fourth valves are nearly always stuck.

Well, again, the older ones had issues that the newer ones I've tried don't. A 25 from the last 20 years or so is usually a really good player, IF it's in good condition. If one is abused like so many of them have been, it's like any other horn that's been poorly cared for, and caveat emptor.

If I wanted a new horn of this type, I'd buy the JP379BB and save a chunk of change. But for a BBb better for someone my age, I'd probably buy the smaller and lighter JP379B, the Packer piggy. If I came across a MW25 used, in good shape, and fairly cheap, I'd have to at least try it out.

.

Here’s a typed out “like“ to the previous post.
I’m no brass-band-tubas aficionado, but the 50-60 -year-old English-made B-flat compensating tubas - which (either oiled more often, or used less often) manage to continue to feature NON-leaky valves (at least to me) – outplay the new ones, both in sonority and intonation.
… and some will totally ignore playing characteristics of any of these, while allowing themselves to be completely distracted by playing position.
——————-
Meinl-Weston model 25 tubas are basically “junior kaiser tubas”. They sound and behave more like a kaiser than a 4/4 sized tuba, but aren’t quite as huge as a kaiser - and thus feature more easily-manageable playing characteristics and easier-to-manage intonation than a typical kaiser.

This has long made me wonder what the "secret" to the old Bessons was. They just play and sound so damn good . . .

And I've seen some with horrendous damage that still played and sounded wonderful.

To the main topic, this freak jury - nor any other - will not serve as any sort of reliable way to pick out an instrument for any individual.
I do realize that the west coast is separated from “the majority of the new and used instruments available for sale in the United States” by thousands of miles and a formidable mountain range, but the only way to pick out an instrument is not to ask anyone else what they think of it, but to play it.

I might analogize this to the Selmer Mark VI series saxophones. Over the decades - as Adolphe Sax himself actually founded the company which would become Selmer - “THE” saxophone (again, the company that Adolphe Sax himself founded) continued to improve, but - for whatever reason, they began to listen to people who had no idea what they were talking about (trying to stretch beyond “just about as good as something can possibly be“), and I believe they’ve gotten worse and worse since the early 1970s.
———-
The single scab on the skin of the vintage Besson compensating B-flat was a sharp E-flat in the staff. Someone could build a trigger for that which could probably be operated by the left hand thumb…but they continue to make those things (now: in other countries) bigger and bigger, and they no longer play anywhere close to as well in tune – at least not in my experience.

GC wrote: ↑Sun Oct 10, 2021 2:07 pm This has long made me wonder what the "secret" to the old Bessons was. They just play and sound so damn good . . .

And I've seen some with horrendous damage that still played and sounded wonderful.

GC wrote: ↑Sun Oct 10, 2021 2:07 pm This has long made me wonder what the "secret" to the old Bessons was. They just play and sound so damn good . . .

And I've seen some with horrendous damage that still played and sounded wonderful.

Amen!!

LargeTuba wrote: ↑Sat Oct 09, 2021 5:58 pm ... and I much prefer my Eastman rotor BBb.

Which one??

Three Valves wrote: ↑Mon Oct 11, 2021 7:03 am

LargeTuba wrote: ↑Sat Oct 09, 2021 5:58 pm ... and I much prefer my Eastman rotor BBb.

Which one??

This one is well reviewed.

hrender wrote: ↑Mon Oct 11, 2021 9:14 am

Three Valves wrote: ↑Mon Oct 11, 2021 7:03 am

LargeTuba wrote: ↑Sat Oct 09, 2021 5:58 pm ... and I much prefer my Eastman rotor BBb.

Which one??

This one is well reviewed.

I talked about mine in another thread, although appearance might be a deterrent to the OP. If they ever do make a sheet brass 4v or 5v, that could be scary-good!

GC wrote: ↑Sat Oct 09, 2021 7:43 pm Well, again, the older ones had issues that the newer ones I've tried don't. A 25 from the last 20 years or so is usually a really good player, IF it's in good condition. If one is abused like so many of them have been, it's like any other horn that's been poorly cared for, and caveat emptor.

If I wanted a new horn of this type, I'd buy the JP379BB and save a chunk of change. But for a BBb better for someone my age, I'd probably buy the smaller and lighter JP379B, the Packer piggy. If I came across a MW25 used, in good shape, and fairly cheap, I'd have to at least try it out.

I tried the JP, and thought it was a fine instrument.

although appearance might be a deterrent to the OP.

Winner winner. I really detest high-ridin' top bows, they remind me too much of them Briteesh contrapshuns.

Three Valves wrote: ↑Mon Oct 11, 2021 7:03 am

LargeTuba wrote: ↑Sat Oct 09, 2021 5:58 pm ... and I much prefer my Eastman rotor BBb.

Which one??

The 623. It's a copy of Miraphone 191. Plays amazing.