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Contact Rob Phillips of Buckeye Brass for questions on parts ....

Breavdah wrote: ↑Tue May 31, 2022 5:14 pm The thing about Cerveny is there's too many. There's 3 basic bodies of 6/4 BBb, 2 of squatty bell BBb, up to 4 normal size+proportion BBb, and variants within like red brass, kranz, 5th valve. Its like..."can they all be good?". Maybe it is so.

Are you serious? Have you looked at how many different models and variations are offered by Miraphone lately? And yet NOBODY criticizes THEM for having “too many”.

I just finished looking at the Miraphone models and counted. There are 249 different models and variations. All the various keys, 3/4-4/4-5/4-6/4, 4-5-6 valves, rotors, pistons, valves straight or slanted, yellow/gold/red brass, lacquer/silver plate/nickel plate/combo finishes, on and on and on. Can they all be good? I guess so.

I have a serious question, and I’m not trying to imply an answer by asking it:

I’ve played six or seven different full-size-or-larger models made by that company. Ignoring the student stuff (which are not included in the tabulation), which models - other than the B-flat 681 and Arion models (to which I give thumbs-up) offer close to point-and-shoot intonation?
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Yes, there are a couple of models that people like to talk about because they are really big, really compact, or short with a bunch of valves, but - with some of those – I think I would hope to have some kind of really good-working on-board main tuning slide trigger (and I’ve never been comfortable using one of those).
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I don’t consider any instruments to be ”cheap” just because they are thin-walled, but I really can’t recommend thin-walled instruments for school purchases – and this includes American sousaphones made in the last few decades.
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…so - beyond all of my rhetoric and opinion-expressing above, which are some of the really-easy—to-play-in-tune Czech tuba models - beyond the 681 B-flat and the Arion B-flat ?

my Piggy was actually really in tune. The only trigger I ever put on it was a 2nd valve kicker to help with the sharp 2-4 fingering, which is hardly unique to that model.

My 601 is less in tune, the low C is flat, the Bb in the staff is sharp, and I'm glad I have a main tuning slide rod.

My 68 CC is pretty good, or at least what I consider to be above average. The only note that I have to make odd adjustments on is the C right above the staff, which I play 1st valve.

I've played several C "piggy" tubas, and the second space C (with most all that I've tried) has been (same as with most makes/models of F tubas, though a different partial) wildly sharp. A "2-3 C" or a main slide plunger are both non-starters (for me).
When I play-test C "piggy" tubas (if/when someone asks about offering one as a partial trade for something) that's always been why I've begged off those trades.

The Arion B-flat (though smaller) offers a very similar type of sound, just about as much sound, and is really easy to play in-tune. Oh yeah...and the Arion B-flat offers chromatic viable valve combinations all the way down to D - with a first valve slide long enough to "do" the E-flat, in the very low range.

I'm sure that I've turned down "bargains" (for flipping) on a whole bunch of tubas (over the years), because I couldn't image me-myself playing those tubas...which (if in business) obviously costs money to view things that way...but my chest feels better when I sell stuff that I myself like.

The 681 and Arion 683 B-flats are known to me to (in my experience) being all-the-same/good. I'm just asking if there are any OTHER models that are KNOWN to be all-the-same-good rather than "inconsistent/they vary"/"mine [was] great"/etc. Retailers like for stuff to (not only) not require that it be "fixed"/checked-over prior to being sold, but (also) that each same-model item be good/the-same.

My Piggy had very good intonation. Four valves and a working 1st slide were all it needed. I have played a 601 BBb that was WONDERFUL. I have also played a few 601 BBb tubas that were dogs. (Unfortunately, I have never played the 601 CC.) I owned a Harmonia F 5 valve tuba with a 6th valve (a so-called "quint" setup) that was very decent, but more trouble than my Yamaha F at that time. It was my stand partner's favorite F tuba I have ever dragged onto the stage at work. It really made a wonderful sound.

I like Cerveny tubas a lot, but not enough to rely on one to pay for my house every month. I have considered looking for a really great 601 in BBb a few times, but I am lazy and what I own right now suits me fine.

I am glad that the Cerveny marque will be available in the US again. I hope they sell many instruments and can get on healthier financial legs.

Good luck, guys!

DonO. wrote: ↑Wed Jun 01, 2022 6:40 am

Breavdah wrote: ↑Tue May 31, 2022 5:14 pm The thing about Cerveny is there's too many. There's 3 basic bodies of 6/4 BBb, 2 of squatty bell BBb, up to 4 normal size+proportion BBb, and variants within like red brass, kranz, 5th valve. Its like..."can they all be good?". Maybe it is so.

Are you serious? Have you looked at how many different models and variations are offered by Miraphone lately? And yet NOBODY criticizes THEM for having “too many”.

I just finished looking at the Miraphone models and counted. There are 249 different models and variations. All the various keys, 3/4-4/4-5/4-6/4, 4-5-6 valves, rotors, pistons, valves straight or slanted, yellow/gold/red brass, lacquer/silver plate/nickel plate/combo finishes, on and on and on. Can they all be good? I guess so.

I solved that problem by getting a 40 year old Miraphone, for which there are fewer choices. It seems pretty good.

bloke wrote: ↑Wed Jun 01, 2022 7:30 am I have a serious question, and I’m not trying to imply an answer by asking it:

I’ve played six or seven different full-size-or-larger models made by that company. Ignoring the student stuff (which are not included in the tabulation), which models - other than the B-flat 681 and Arion models (to which I give thumbs-up) offer close to point-and-shoot intonation?
———————-
Yes, there are a couple of models that people like to talk about because they are really big, really compact, or short with a bunch of valves, but - with some of those – I think I would hope to have some kind of really good-working on-board main tuning slide trigger (and I’ve never been comfortable using one of those).
—————————
I don’t consider any instruments to be ”cheap” just because they are thin-walled, but I really can’t recommend thin-walled instruments for school purchases – and this includes American sousaphones made in the last few decades.
=========
…so - beyond all of my rhetoric and opinion-expressing above, which are some of the really-easy—to-play-in-tune Czech tuba models - beyond the 681 B-flat and the Arion B-flat ?

I own a CBB686-4B Symphonia 3. It's a 4 valve 4/4 (or 5/4?) with a 2nd slide kicker, which i use for E and B (2-4 combination). In my opinion it is easy to play in tune, but i'm not a pro. So if you get the chance to try this model please let me know your experiences.