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I received this instrument bartering a little repair work for a local school. Thought it was kinda cool. In great shape and the original case. Chrome plated with two valves (whole step piston and half step rotor). Kind of interesting that, as a G bugle, it is more horn-shaped than mellophone-shaped, with the big throat and modest bell flare, and also a horn receiver instead of a mellophone receiver. Sounds pretty much like a horn. It is pitched in low G, which means that regular horn fingerings work instead of alto horn/mellophone fingerings.



I did a little more digging and found an original Olds catalog and was surprised that Olds offered both a mellophone bugle and a French horn bugle. Here is the ad below. Wonder why they did that? I do agree with the ad copy that it sounds very much horn-like.



If anyone wants it, $75 plus shipping?

Neat!

I've always wondered why mid-range marching brass took so long to standardize. Mellophone vs marching french horn. Alto/tenor horn etc. Frumpet & mellophonium. Alto cornet.Eb alto flugelhorn Not to mention F vs Bb mellophone. All the other marching voices got their act together pretty quickly but people kept coming up with new and goofy ideas for alto.

The mellophone is in the same octave as the soprano. The Frenchie is an octave lower. Also, the timbres are quite different.

If I finish ALL of the other - - - - ( ie. "projects") around here, I'd like to put together an ALTERNATE bell section for my F cimbasso (using the bell and bow from that instrument shown on the r.h. side).

Stripping off the chrome and nickel isn't that big of a deal...or sure, I could leave the chrome on there, shoot translucent blue over it, and end up with this sort of effect: (Thank-you, AI.)



I probably wouldn't like it as well as what I have (which I love), but it would satisfy my curiosity, and - well - cimbasso bell sections (given a head start such as that) are not different to put together.

You know those “Bach” marching baritone bells that people use for cimbassos? I have a full length, untrimmed one from the factory stashed here. I’ve thought above collecting up the rest of the parts and finishing a cimbasso. Another project in neutral, I guess.

MiBrassFS wrote: ↑Mon Oct 07, 2024 3:41 pm You know those “Bach” marching baritone bells that people use for cimbassos? I have a full length, untrimmed one from the factory stashed here. I’ve thought above collecting up the rest of the parts and finishing a cimbasso. Another project in neutral, I guess.

A friend of mine did a good job building an E-flat cimbasso out of one of those, but it just didn't sound right. They backed up, made the bell section out of something like what is shown in the previous posts, and the instrument was far more successful.

I don't know? Maybe that size bell would work okay for a BB-flat cimbasso, but I've never looked into making one that long, and am not interested in looking into it.

I think the stubby bell and back bow aren’t a good combo for cimbasso. The bell here is the same proportion as an F contrabass trombone. It’s 2+ times longer than the chopped baritone version. It might be a better combo for cimbasso with a smaller back bow.

Get yer $75 cimbasso bell right here, folks...!

Maybe list it on the Frankentuba Facebook group?

arpthark wrote: ↑Mon Oct 07, 2024 8:23 am I did a little more digging and found an original Olds catalog and was surprised that Olds offered both a mellophone bugle and a French horn bugle. Here is the ad below. Wonder why they did that? I do agree with the ad copy that it sounds very much horn-like.

The French horn bugle was first, and was the first "mid-voice" horn to be added to the hornline, occupying the sonic space between the soprano and baritone sections. The mellophone bugle came a bit later, but they didn't just replace the French horns when they came around for a couple of reasons.

First, arrangers were happy to have more voices available in the hornline. 2 valves are still pretty limiting to write for, so having more timbres allowed more variation in the sound of the corps. So not only were there French horn and mellophone bugles, but also flugelhorn bugles and alto bugles - sometimes all at the same time. The mid voices of the corps were rife with experimentation.

Second, because the French horn bugles were an octave longer than the mellophones (and altos, and flugels, and sopranos, and meehaphones), they were fully chromatic in the register they played in and thus were able to fill out a lot of harmonies that wouldn't be possible otherwise with a 2-valve hornline. This is why, even after corps started standardizing their mid voices, the French horn remained alongside the mellophone. Having owned one of the rare 3-valve G French horn bugles, I can say that you really don't need the 3rd valve at all.

Some corps did ditch the French horns, mainly because multiple mid-voices were harder to keep in tune and the French horns were notoriously hard to play well while marching. And once three valves were legalized, the French horns no longer really had a purpose and went extinct pretty quickly.

gocsick wrote: ↑Mon Oct 07, 2024 9:06 am Neat!

I've always wondered why mid-range marching brass took so long to standardize. Mellophone vs marching french horn. Alto/tenor horn etc. Frumpet & mellophonium. Alto cornet.Eb alto flugelhorn Not to mention F vs Bb mellophone. All the other marching voices got their act together pretty quickly but people kept coming up with new and goofy ideas for alto.

As mentioned above, drum corps of the time had a good reason to keep the French horn around alongside the mellophone.

As for outside of drum corps, the answer is simply because it took all of those different instruments to get to an instrument (the marching mellophone) that actually plays well and works well on the field. Mellophoniums are a bear to play and have bad ergonomics, so while they were used by a lot of marching bands because there was no other option in 1957, they weren't good and the bands were eager to replace them with something better. The Getzen frumpet is even worse, it is truly awful. Alto cornet and alto flugelhorn don't project enough for the field, Bb marching French horns are harder to play than mellophones for no upside, and bell-front alto horns look ridiculous (along with American baritones), don't have good ergonomics, and aren't terrible players but aren't great either. Even the first marching mellophones (Olds for example) were not that good.

Alto marching brass was a problem that took a LONG time to properly solve.