bloke posts too much about (in particular) Bordogni, and not enough about instruments, bags, and notable players

[bloke]

bloke: "Bordogni-Bordogni-Bordogni-blah-blah-blah"...

Something I tend to see quite often (with those who actually/occasionally discuss playing the tuba, and not exclusively instruments, bags, other accessories, and tuba personalities) is a distinction between "bel canto" etudes (melodic - studying phrasing and musical expression) and "technical" etudes.

When discussing "technical" etudes, players will discuss which ones they prefer (championing this-or-that "technical" book, as they perceive them as being more "interesting" than others...(likely: because they perceive their favorite{s} as more "bel canto" oriented).

If there's a player who (over-and-over - decade-in/decade-out) has continued to revisit the Bordogni 40-whatever etudes (mostly from Rochut book 1) or has gone through Rochut book 1 over-and-over, or Shoemaker (etc...)

Consider digging into Rochut books 2 and 3.

>> These subsequent Rochut-trombone/Bordogni books become a good bit more "technical" while continuing to be "bel canto" etudes. (ie. they become both "technical" yet continue being "bel canto" etudes...and - hey - if a player has not studied them before - yes: they still are clearly identifiable as Bordogni, but no: they are NOT the "same old $h!t"...and (yup) they're challenging. Quite a few of them are 2-1/2 to 4 pages long, so there's an "endurance" factor in the subsequent books, as well. (Not lower, but) the upper range - in the subsequent books - is also extended.

Many players like to play these two octaves lower than Rochut's trombone octave. That's really good for "working" the low range, but (seriously) when doing that they - pretty much - become more "technical" and less "bel canto" (as - necessarily - the overwhelming majority of phrases will need to be broken - coming up for air - than when playing them one octave below the trombone octave, which is already going to require more air and more phrase "rethinking" than when playing them on trombone (or sung by a soprano).

Particularly with (as an "old man") this
- 6/4
- extra-large bore
- rotary
(all three of which offer MORE challenges - regarding achieving a pleasing "legato")

tuba, playing through all the etudes (with their super-long phrasing marks) and playing them AS IF they are "slur" markings (which they mostly are not), is quite challenging.

Personally (as now: recovering from a lung infection) I've had to RE-BREAK an old long-ago-broken bad habit - a habit of "huffing" through legatos (rather than smoothly blowing through them). More personal (not-important-to-anyone-reading-this) information, is that I'm reminding myself to take in generous amounts of air (as it no longer triggers coughing) as well as the "smooth air" (vs. huh-huh-huh thing, which does nothing good, limits speed, destroys phrases and - well - sounds bad).

When I decide to study any of them with more of a realistic variety of articulations, I'll scan/print out a selected etude and edit it myself, including (to me) musically-appropriate articulations.

Considering "technical" (which typically involve a lot of "tonguing") etudes vs. "bel canto" etudes, think through quintet/orchestral/band (ok, and - doesn't exist in the free market) and solo works...a considerably larger percentage of passages (particularly the passages which we judge as a bit "treacherous") are legato, whereby "wham-wham-wham" or even "whammity-whammity-whammity-wham" passages tend to not be as difficult.

One thing (as I'm grateful to see them, as my own playing certainly needs work on these) fairly common in the later Rochut books' Bordogni passages are strings of arpeggiated pitches (from high) which work their way (supposedly) gracefully to low.

OK...This isn't as important a skill, but...
Reading the bass clef at the octave (as well as being able to read C treble clef and B-flat treble clef) are all things that tuba players (ok..."working" tuba players or "tuba players who hope - someday - to work") should be able to read just as fluently as at-pitch bass clef.

summary: Rochut (trombone) Bordogni books 2 and 3...If only having brushed against them years ago (or - I'd wager as more typical: never having dived into them), and STUDY 'em...you know: "etudes".

[Casca Grossa]

That being said, we want more pictures of slicked out tubas leaning against the front of Blokeplace.

[bloke]

That being said, we want more pictures of slicked out tubas leaning against the front of Blokeplace.

This morning - after my warmup routine - I started back at the beginning of book 2...though I skipped 61, because it's the same as #13 in the "43..." book, and I'm tired of seeing/playing that one...so I ran though 62 - 76, played a bunch of sharps, double sharps, and even some E-flat minor (7 flats), began to feel guilty about not fixing any horns, and put the tuba down.

again: My lungs, slurring, and thinking (being sick messes with thinking - along with all the physical symptoms) are coming back.

[Three Valves]

That being said, we want more pictures of slicked out tubas leaning against the front of Blokeplace.

Cheap!

[bloke]

That being said, we want more pictures of slicked out tubas leaning against the front of Blokeplace.

Cheap!

meh...
RATHER THAN THOSE, I believe I will post some videos (the type seen on facebook which we all delight in auditing)...ie.
"I haven't finished working up this amazing tuba solo, but I know that you all are tremendously interested in my progress thus far..."

[Tom C]

Playing Bel Canto was an important part of Bill Bell's teaching, according to his students. For my teacher Sam Green (who studied with Mr. Bell in New York) Bel Canto was THE most important thing. My sense of it is that this is now regarded (in some quarters, at least) as old-fashioned. I still highly value the ability to play a melody convincingly and musically. Just my two cents.

[the elephant]

… this is now regarded (in some quarters, at least) as old-fashioned.

Teachers who teach this are frauds and thieves. Some of them are well-known, too. And yes, if you are one of these frauds and thieves I invite you to excoriate me as you explain such stupid teaching.

Go ahead. I'll wait.

But be prepared for my reply. Your name does not intimidate me. Your position does not intimidate me. But your argument in support of poorly reasoned pedagogical ideas will probably keep me in stitches.

And I'll expect you to back up your lousy teaching with your name and institution so I can try to get you fired for being said fraudster.

I am not BS-ing about this. We have TOO MANY BAD TEACHERS in TOO MANY UNIVERSITY MUSIC PROGRAMS. Some need to go. If you teach stuff like this you're one of them.

Come at me, bro.

[MikeS]

My college trombone teacher gave us assigned listening every week of vocal recordings. It was not unusual to spend the greater part of a lesson, with the vocal music on the stand and trombones in hand, defending why you thought De Neri sang a particular Bellini passage better than Bjorling. I did not turn into somebody with a world class sound, but I learned more about opening my mind and analyzing problems there than any place else in that school. To crib from the old movie “The Paper Chase,” you came into his studio with a skull full of mush and you left thinking like a musician.

[the elephant]

Many of us had to enroll in voice lessons for a semester. This was fantastically useful and educational. Also, the summer sessions were taught by a single brass professor on a rotational basis, and it was suggested that we take lessons every summer so that we could learn from all of the brass faculty. I got lessons with Drs. Leonard Candelaria, William Scharnberg, Vern Kagarice, Royce Lumpkinm, and Mr. Keith Johnson. This was another well-considered idea. Additionally, we were strongly encouraged to travel and take lessons with other highly regarded tuba teachers. This is how I started with Mr. Jacobs. I also took two lessons a week, one covering CC tuba and its lit, and one for F tuba. I got a lot out of my school besides the required coursework.

[MiBrassFS]

Bit of a sidestep…

This month’s ITA Journal features a historical article about Joannès Rochut, authored by Douglas Yeo. Pretty interesting.

[bloke]

The last post is great, but referring back a couple of more posts, the best teachers always refer students to other sources, and to refer them to other teachers demonstrates a great deal of confidence. A tuba teacher referred me to a horn teacher. That horn teacher put a great more emphasis on phrasing, (as horn players actually play melodies all the time).
I remember when I was first looking at Bach cello suite movements, a teacher referred me to the library and the hardback volume of complete Bach works containing those suites that didn't feature any arches or dashes or dots. They then referred me to the Pablo Casals LP collection and suggested that I at least listen to those and then put my own arches and dashes and dots on the music before working on any of the movements.
(Of course, Casals point of reference was romantic, but I'm not sure we could sell these movements to patrons' ears on recitals without adding some romanticism to the interpretation.)