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Every time one of you college boys sends me an invitation to one of these pages that you put up,
I can’t help but think of the Schmenges.

bloke wrote: ↑Sat Jan 29, 2022 9:49 pm Every time one of you college boys sends me an invitation to one of these pages that you put up,
I can’t help but think of the Schmenges.

I think of the Inges.

bloke wrote: ↑Sat Jan 29, 2022 9:49 pm Every time one of you college boys sends me an invitation to one of these pages that you put up,
I can’t help but think of the Schmenges.

Now I have an urge for some cabbage rolls and coffee.

I really need some playing tips from a 19-year-old, who’s stumbling through Tyrell and Haddad - with their “C tuba for college”.
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“O guru, O guru…
I’m playing this little Sunday afternoons trio gig with a tenor guitar player who tunes sharp, so I end up having to play tunes like ‘Tangerine’ (etc.) in F-sharp…and that’s ‘hard’.
There’s a guy in the back of the guitar store down the street who says he can cut off the main tuning slide on my college’s Meinl-Weston 4460 F tuba…
…so how much should I tell him to cut off ?”

I guess there can be a few exceptions. My daughter was teaching oboe lessons to a student - only a year younger than herself - as well as one adult lady (my daughter’s accompanist, who had sparked this adult piano player’s interest in the oboe…and that lady is still playing oboe in a community band well over 25 years later) when my daughter was a few months shy of being fifteen years old (yet she had already been playing some recitals and three movement concerti with community orchestras, as well as making her own reeds, etc.). Full-time players in town weren’t bothered by this, because they had enough to do, but a couple of the per service and freelance players (needing every student they could manage to lasso) were annoyed by it. Fwiw, her 14-year-old student placed very high in the middle school division honor band tryout stuff…but that having been said, I tend to always credit students for their own achievements, and not their teachers.

bloke wrote: ↑Thu Feb 03, 2022 7:40 am I really need some playing tips from a 19-year-old, who’s stumbling through Tyrell and Haddad - with their “C tuba for college”.

One is never too inexperienced or lacking in talent to begin telling others what to do or how to do it.

Isn't that what Kolig is for??

Three Valves wrote: ↑Thu Feb 03, 2022 8:12 amOne is never too inexperienced or lacking in talent to begin telling others what to do or how to do it.

Isn't that what Kolig is for??

To be fair, I really only delegate that type of view (of those institutions) to the departments which are completely and specifically built on foundations of nonsense, such as their sociology and history departments, though it is obvious that nonsense narratives have deep fingers into all the other departments, as well.

Oh, man. That was fun. Thanks for bringing them up, bloke.

I don’t know if it’s really necessary to say this, but the Late Night band was pantomiming a soundtrack.
Will Lee did enter college studying the French horn, but is not a tuba player…certainly not of the quality heard on that soundtrack.

The actual John Candy/Gene Levy movie, “The Last Polka”, Is a tongue-in-cheek fake documentary which pokes fun at those who view themselves - and present themselves - as “a pretty big deal“.
Thus, the reference at the beginning of this thread.

I'm going to partially disagree here. Part of becoming a "professional" or an otherwise established practitioner of any field involves taking yourself seriously and demanding of yourself that you produce as high quality content as you can as early on as possible. For example, if I were a journalism student who had dreams of working for a large news outlet, I would want to write my articles for my college newspaper with the same seriousness as I would if I were at the large outlet and demand of myself that I put out content to the utmost of my ability.

There will be no point in anyone's life where a mentor, teacher, or professional taps you on the head and says, "You have now achieved such a high status, that you may put your product out into public." If you wait for that, you'll never get anywhere.

So you do what you can at the point where you are. You have professional headshots. You post recital footage. You post tips like "Tuba Professors HATE HIM for this ONE LITTLE TRICK." You see what sticks, and you try to hack out a corner in a brutally competitive field. If you have it, you have it, and it will blossom. If you don't, you don't, and you'll never get off the ground. But if you want people to take you seriously, you have to take yourself seriously. Dress for the job you want.

But I made the mistake earlier in life of waiting for permission, and it got me nowhere.

NOW DON'T GET ME WRONG. You can take yourself seriously and put out junk content, for sure. Part of taking yourself seriously is being honest with yourself in reflection. But the world is big. The internet is big. People trying things doesn't bother me.

Look at me, for instance. I'm a nobody. But I still have opinions about staccato.

bloke wrote: ↑Thu Feb 03, 2022 7:40 am I really need some playing tips from a 19-year-old, who’s stumbling through Tyrell and Haddad - with their “C tuba for college”.

Just type "Expert Village Tuba" into the YouTube search and you will get all of the important playing tips you need.

I believe one of the worst mistakes that college children make (with this tack) is to post audio files of their playing, as uploads are "forever".

It's good to be encouraged by one's progress, but it's even more important to be grounded - realizing how much farther there is to go.

College-aged children - who've chosen to study "the arts" - are coddled, but - once beyond matriculation - are dumped by the (teachers/patrons) coddling class.

Of course, most college-aged children are not particularly well-grounded (as far as "big picture" and "reality" are concerned), and aren't particularly aware of "what is to come".

Not only are they told that they are now adults (often: false), but also that their achievements/accomplishments are extraordinary (often: also false).

Most have not been forced to embrace the truth - that producing 100% is "minimally required", below 100% production is defined as failure, and that even just a few "below 100% ventures" are cause for dismissal (at least, with most employers)...and yet (several decades of "grade inflation" set aside, for now) they seem to be satisfied with scoring between the upper-80's to the mid-90's percentiles within their controlled/coddled environments.

Artist musicians think about the .001 percents of their performances which are less than perfect (and work on strategies to eliminate the possibilities of those occurring in the future), just as I tend (though I also embrace reality as to "what is possible", based on current physical condition, time, and financing) to dwell on the small portions of my instrument repair jobs that end up not quite measuring up to what I might expect of myself. If someone brings me a sticking valve (even if some dubious make) and I agree to try to help them, if it continues to stick 1:100 times, I don't charge for "trying" to fix it, because I will not have solved the problem. Even though (due to this top-down - so far - two-year siege of the economy and of society) I'm epically "out of practice" playing (hopefully) cute/clever/humorous 32-bar tuba solos (as jazz combo jobs are so seldom, as compared to two years ago), I mentally "get on to myself" if/when I screw up a bar or two when "making up crap"...

...oh yeah...and - if/when someone made a little phone video of one of those jobs and emails it to me - I do NOT publish examples of my mediocrity on fazebutt (since - well...after all - it's "pretty good" ).

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When I was barely 18 (began kolij a during the last few months of being 17) my studio teacher stuck me on a music school-wide student recital to play an (really easy) piece - by the composer, Rodger Vaughan" - called Concertpiece (I think...??) I knew it was easy, and knew that "playing that piece" (other than "doing it in front of a bunch of people"...and I was already quite accustomed to that) was no big deal...so - when there was a hearty round of "That's really good FOR A TUBA PLAYER" applause, I laughed it off (read: grounded). For at least three years, I'd been playing solo guitar gigs at private and semi-private cocktail parties, I knew what "really-REALLY good" was (better guitar playing than mine), I knew that my guitar playing was "good enough to be paid" (as - to me - the payment was "the applause"), but I also knew how far I still had to go.

tubanh84 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 03, 2022 11:25 am For example, if I were a journalism student...

That analogy needs honing.

"I believe one of the worst mistakes that college children make (with this tack) is to post audio files of their playing, as uploads are "forever"."

I believe one of the worst mistakes that anyone can make is to not routinely making recordings of themselves, listening back to their recordings, and sure posting their recordings for others to enjoy, or to not enjoy if "they" so choose. The potential benefits far out weigh the "image" (aka Facebook ) you are trying to create for yourself at the development stage in your journey to attain a higher degree/level of"professionalism," and there are different levels of "professionals," right

If you wait until you're "perfect", you will either be waiting forever, or you won't be "real." And we all can tell who's "real" when live performances happen .

With all of that said, I understand the point (s) you are trying to get across with this thread. Quality control

Obviously I disagree, and prefer to be critiqued privately by my betters, rather than publicly by a 15,000-member freak jury (with a huge plurality of those neither being particularly good at doing nor teaching), and who tend to remember people by singular things that they - whether will-advised or ill-advised - posted on Facebook.

Those who very seriously pursue musical performance tend to sound vastly different at age 27 versus age 17. I’m just discouraging the 19-year-olds – who are all wrapped up in being first chair in the marching band, and/or are the best player at their junior college - posting a whole bunch of MAD-TV-esque videos.

"The 15,000 member freak-jury" is your future audience and patrons

"Look at what I could do", isn't that the "art" of becoming a performer

I would venture a guess that serious teachers of serious students - who aren’t quite ready for prime time - discourage those students from posting sound files on heavily-subscribed-to Facebook pages - asking for comments.

Believing that I am guessing correctly at how such teachers would judge the situation, I will trust their judgment.

Truly remarkable recordings are useful in corralling a following, but I really don’t see how flawed recordings (such as the majority to which I seem to be regularly exposed, and from which I tend to click away quickly and dismissively) can effectively accomplish this.

Further, I strongly suspect that the silent conservatory level professional teachers - who scan these posts, but never contribute - will tend to agree… and EVEN THOUGH “it’s just the tuba or baritone horn”.

"I would venture a guess that serious teachers of serious students - who aren’t quite ready for prime time - discourage those students from posting sound files on heavily-subscribed-to Facebook pages - asking for comments"

Why do you think that is? Are they worried more about the students "image" or theirs Who's "interests"

"Believing that I am guessing correctly at how such teachers would judge the situation, I will trust their judgment"

With few professional jobs out there, how many of these teachers/professors actually yield "professionals" How much money is made from people who are sheltered and remain hidden, at the advice of the professor until they graduate and then experience reality. I'm not attacking professors here, that's their job...to bring X number of students for x number of dollars, and then provide the very best instruction they can. (Ultimately, it's the students choice to study XYZ, right ) However, where do you draw the line as to what's "ethical."

I mean no disrespect to anyone

OK… Naming a name, I might guess (??) that Mr. Baer would prefer that his NRFPT students pay attention to his advice, and not so much to that offered 30 or 40 community bandsman - who may feel as though they have something remarkably valuable to say to his students.

Here’s something that you aren’t really grasping, Dan:

When you post videos, they don’t suck.

Finally, I suspect that you are not only arguing with my views, but with the identical views of a tremendous number of people who read but do not post.
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Since the page was created, I believe I have posted TWO mp4 files of my playing on the Facebook page, tuba/euphonium:
(and I feel as though I’ve got pretty good control over my $h!t, just fwiw)

- After repairing a school’s Yamaha 103 3/4 tuba, I recorded myself playing the loser-tuba-ditty from “The Price is Right“, as a comment on someone’s corny joke.
- Recently, after finishing up the epic 6/4 Holton project, I recorded a very short low-range excerpt from Prokofiev’s “Romeo and Juliet”, in order to address someone’s false truism/preconceived notion regarding the low range response of typical 6/4-size tubas.

Neither file was longer than six seconds.

I understand, and I am not trying to say that students shouldn't listen and respect their teachers advice. After all, they are paying them to make them better.

What I am saying is that I don't think (yikes, that's dangerous) that there's anything wrong with teachers encouraging their students to make recording, videos, etc for public consumption. I think there could be some valuable skills that could be learned/developed through the process, such as becoming a better player through more accountability (real world), learning social media/marketing skills, learning recording techniques,etc. Mistakes...sure, they will be made... you can count on that, whether you are a student or professional. There's a lot of value in that as well.

Another point to consider is that most "students" won't have access to the same types of jobs. In other words, most students will not have the opportunity to play in an orchestra, or a similar type of music job. However, there's still opportunities and a lot of money to be had playing an instrument. All of the above skills will be required to succeed.

Lastly, I think that it says a lot about a teacher who is willing to allow a student to pursue this type of "education" in this way. The teacher/professor will be there to encourage and provide advice in both success and failure. Once you're out of school, you're for the most part, on your own.

"Finally, I suspect that you are not only arguing with my views, but with the identical views of a tremendous number of people who read but do not post."