Bordogni favorites?

[bloke]

Of the 43 (in the "tuba" book - that Chester Roberts, a past tuba player in the Cleveland and Pittsburgh orchestras, picked from those that Joannes Rochut chose for his 120 featured in three trombone books), which are your personal favorites?

[Ace]

#33 in the tuba book. Because I don't presently have a tuba, I play all the studies on my French horn and C valved trombone.

Ace

[Three Valves]

The first 14.

Nothing with more than one sharp or five flats.

Like I said…

[DonO.]

I like 1-4, 8, 10, and 14. On BBb, which is all I play.

We should do the same thing for Blazhevich!

[bort2.0]

I like 1-4, 8, 10, and 14. On BBb, which is all I play.

We should do the same thing for Blazhevich!

I'll have to check the book for my favorite #. I never paid attention the the numbers. It's mostly whichever page was so worn from being open all the time, the book just opens itself to the right spot.

I've always been a Kopprasch guy

[bloke]

Blazhevich is a clef studies book for trombone -written down an octave - or whatever - for tuba. I just don’t see the point (??) in playing those on tuba. There aren’t any clefs to study (other than bass), and they’re all just sort of…readable.

If anyone’s looking to get tangled up in a big mess, pick up Verne Reynolds 48 études for Horn transcribed for tuba. (The first 24 are fast and slow studies on each of the twelve intervals within the octave.) It’s not a gratifying book to master - and neither is it much of a vehicle for boosting one’s ego, but – if it doesn’t kill you – it will make you stronger.

[Nworbekim]

i just like the entire book... i play something from it every session. i'm not sure of the numbers though, i just turn til i see what i'm looking for.

there's several i could play every day for an hour the rest of my life and STILL not get exactly right. there's ALWAYS some little something that is missed.

[DonO.]

Blashevich is a clef studies book for trombone -written down an octave - or whatever - for tuba. I just don’t see the point (??) in playing those on tuba. There aren’t any clefs to study (other than bass), and they’re all just sort of…readable.

Blazhevich was core to my undergraduate studies in my first and second years, along with Bordogni. I enjoy playing many of the Blazhevich studies, others not so much. There is more variety in those than Bordogni, which are all legato studies. Blazhevich includes technical studies as well, and all of them are very “musical”. In third and fourth years I moved on to Kopprasch, Griegorev, and others. But when you spoke of favorite etudes in Bordogni, I actually immediately thought of Blazhevich, because I find many of those more enjoyable to play than Bordogni.

[bone-a-phone]

As a bone player, in my lessons I've had to play all 3 Rochut books. Most folks don't see the second two which seem to be mostly about extending the melody to many keys and subdivided beats.

I studied with John Swallow, so Rochut was about lip slurs, alt positions, and of course phrasing and expression.

I've used these books to learn euph and tuba. The slurring is obviously easier with valves, but I was never able to get the dynamic subtlety that I got on the trombone.

But in the first (trombone) book, #6 is one of my favorites. You can play it slow and moody or fast and carefree.

#7 lies well on the slide, and the grace notes and rolling triplets are the key to a fun tune to play. Of course you've got to nail the arpeggio at the end to make ot come off.

#8 is slow and delicate, and makes me feel better when l'm in a bad mood.

#9 you have to be playing well to make this one feel good, but when I can play it, it makes me happy.

#16 if I could only play one Rochut the rest of my life, it would be this one. It perfectly captures the "vocal" part of these etudes as well as the trombone.

#26 makes me think of Tom McGrady (who also went to New England Conservatory).

But I think my favorite is the second half of #60. You gotta play it fast. Rolling arpeggios and scales along with some rubato and occasional chromatics... Check it out.

[bloke]

I know I ended up with that book, but don't remember buying it (I suspect it was given to me in a stack of stuff...). I probably now have multiple copies of several things, as - often - used tubas show up with books in their cases or bags' side pockets.

The Blazhevich DUETS are fun to read with friends...Someone put the second part all in bass clef - getting it out of tenor and alto, but I don't know where to find that.

https://imslp.org/wiki/Concert_Duets_fo ... Vladislav)

(I can stay in tenor clef, but don't ask me - per the original Blazhevich trombone clef studies book - to wildly switch back-and-forth...and - if you don't want me to be able to read something - be sure and hand me something in alto clef. )

https://imslp.org/wiki/Concert_Duets_fo ... Vladislav)

For "technical" studies, I started out with the Kopprasch horn book, went to the Ferling 48 studies (oboe/saxophone, but also for bassoon...but the treble clef book is easier, because - again - it STAYS in treble clef), and then busted a gut with the Verne Reynolds 48 etudes (interval studies) stuff. I never much messed with Arban or Clarke, but worked some of the trumpet Schlossberg book.

https://s9.imslp.org/files/imglnks/usim ... Op._31.pdf

https://cupdf.com/download/verne-reynol ... rench-horn

I always viewed vocalises as the most "technical" (the word, "technical" broadly pointing towards proper execution), because legato playing on tuba - as well as musical phrasing - seem to be such common "tuba player" shortcomings.

Also, I like (when convenient) to work out of treble clef books, because treble clef is the primary clef in which western music is written down...and (using middle C as a shift point, and pretending to play tubas built in various lengths - again: using various valve pattern paradigms) treble clef studies can be "moved around".

Here's a download of some Concone vocalises...for anyone who occasionally grows weary of Bordogni's stylings:
https://www.uniatlantico.edu.co/wp-cont ... rumpet.pdf

Mostly, I'm pulling out etude books because - suddenly showering myself with B-flat tubas (and with the leftover B-flat tuba reading proficiency from when I was 17) - I don't want "B-flat tuba" to just be a "double"...but wish for it to be yet another (reading-wise, as well as knowing my own instruments) "main squeeze".

re: all trombone Bordogni books...They're all here, and all have been perused/played. ' maybe too much of a good thing (??)...but - with that many - one can certainly choose from many and (even) choose to tackle some (again) that were pretty tough to tackle the first time though ("way back when").

[hrender]

When I was briefly thinking of majoring in music many years ago, I primarily worked through Kopprasch and Blazevich, with brief forays into the Bobo/Bixby Bach books and a few others. I wasn't much of a fan of either K or B, which is why I ended up in Computer Science, I guess. I now play Bordogni more, and find it more enjoyable. I stick mostly to the first 14 because I'm not that good, but there are some later ones in the book that are enjoyable. Back in school I did not stray out of "tuba" books, but I've started to do that a bit more the last few years, usually sticking to treble clef C stuff (flute, voice, etc.). I know I should learn transposition, but time has been a problem.

Coincidentally, I got a mailer today from Qpress saying they have all the Rochut trombone books now in a collection: https://qpress.ca/product/complete-roch ... mbone-pdf/. This includes the duets. The Blazevich trombone duets are available here: https://www.alfred.com/concert-duets/p/00-K04708/.

[Billy M.]

If anyone’s looking to get tangled up in a big mess, pick up Verne Reynolds 48 études for Horn transcribed for tuba. (The first 24 are fast and slow studies on each of the twelve intervals within the octave.) It’s not a gratifying book to master - and neither is it much of a vehicle for boosting one’s ego, but – if it doesn’t kill you – it will make you stronger.

That book is no longer in print. I've been working on transcribing it to a more readable medium considering it's handwritten. If I remember, I'm about 20 etudes in and they're pretty nuts based on playback of my music software.

[bloke]

I studied the first 24, as I just seem to think that the second 24 were add-ons.
I had to take a ruler and a pin to darken the staff lines just so I could read the music.
I just came across it again in my old stuff, FWIW.

It’s astonishing what some people were willing to release – in the past – for publication.

[Doc]

Blazhevich is a clef studies book for trombone -written down an octave - or whatever - for tuba. I just don’t see the point (??) in playing those on tuba. There aren’t any clefs to study (other than bass), and they’re all just sort of…readable.

If anyone’s looking to get tangled up in a big mess, pick up Verne Reynolds 48 études for Horn transcribed for tuba. (The first 24 are fast and slow studies on each of the twelve intervals within the octave.) It’s not a gratifying book to master - and neither is it much of a vehicle for boosting one’s ego, but – if it doesn’t kill you – it will make you stronger.

Blazevich has never been a favorite, but, maybe because of its design (as you described), it has proven itself very useful for the purpose of increasing my Eb reading skills.

[Doc]

I had the Rochut book, and still do (so worn that it had to be replaced). And Tyrell (in pieces), Kopprasch (threadbare today), Blazevich (replaced due to wear), Haddad 20 Etudes, Bach Cello Suites, Arban for tbone, and a boatload of solos. Plus excerpts. And songbooks. I never saw or even heard of the tuba book of Bordogni studies until I was out of school for quite some time. I can't answer the question as posed, as I don't know the corresponding Rochut vocalises.

[bloke]

yeah...
I'm trying to find as many "sharp-keys" vocalises as I can.
3 to 7 sharps, etc.
I'm needing to get into the B-flat tuba 2-3 valve combination pitches with complete security.
Further, the 2-3 pitches which are NOT the tonic (ie. NOT F=sharp major-minor NOR G-flat major) - but are encountered in passing - are the more challenging ones to play smoothly in passages.
(Funny how that wild lick in "Carmina Burana" (with the octave D's and E's) is as secure as Leavenworth, and are as easy as pie...but I'm going to work on that single F-sharp...)

I've been emailing back-and-forth (every six months or so we "catch up"...and it's not usually about "tuba stuff", but...) to a "known-and-loved-by-all-tuba-players" tuba player about my new-to-me B-flat. After a couple of emails on that topic, he asked, "How do you deal with the 'bubbly' attacks with the big and big-bore B-flat tuba?" to which I responded, "With a super-hero admitting that this is something with which they also struggle, you're already making me feel better."

[the elephant]

I have never used the Rochut books. The Roberts book has always suited my needs, and I spend a lot more time on simpler vocalises for buzzing or warming up. Volumes I and II of David Kuehn's old "60 Musical Studies" are my favorites to work from, actually.

As far as a favorite "frilly" vocalises, Bordogni's "36 Vocalises" (for Mezzo-Soprano, in treble clef with the piano parts) is my go-to book, and out of that, the third one is my favorite. (I have no idea if it appears in the Rochut books.) For years I assigned this to my advanced students, so I have a nice edition in bass clef that I did many years ago, but did not set in Finale until 2008.

Give it a test drive, Joe. I bet it would be just dandy on your cimbasso…

https://www.dropbox.com/s/zwsxrkafq7ryc ... 3.pdf?dl=0

[bloke]

LOL...snagged it...thnx !!!

I don't spend much time playing "pretty/frilly" stuff on that Goldberg-ish contraption (as I'm quite sure you knew)...
...and my fingers get twisted up on knots attempting to read stuff (much below C below the staff) with only 5 valves on an F instrument.
(For a recent post-Beatles-music pops concert with a cover band - individually-recorded 1970's music by the former Fab Four - I had to forgo part of my lunch break between rehearsals and wig out some fast-ish really low licks (again: no 6th valve).

...but your transcribed vocalise is sort-of typical of quite a bit of the Book II/III Joannes Rochut-selected ones...other than their length (often 2 - 2-1/2 pages)...ie. "a whole bunch of doodle-ee-doo-doo's PLUS being semi-marathon-ish (with me being quite ready for them to conclude after a page and a half).

I like D major...I dislike F-sharp major (along with it's G-sharp-to-F-sharp somewhat treacherous huge-B-flat-tuba "bubbly" slurs)...but am digging into them on FatBastard...each time: AFTER a tall cup of coffee.

weirdness:
It's MORE difficult to execute slurs on that instrument when there's WATER in it, but EASIER to execute slurs on that instrument after dumping OIL (about the same amount of oil as the amount of water to which I'm referring) into it.

bloke "Thanks for another vocalise, and - well... - FatBastard is offering this older guy a (fascinating, actually) new rabbit hole in which to crawl.

EDIT: Singing through your vocalise, I'm thinking that is is one of them that's found in one of the Rochut books...It sounds familiar...and even more familiar than "because all Bordogni vocalises sound the same".

[the elephant]

Here is a real barn burner for F tuba. I think you might enjoy it.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/4eq9jwtqswht7 ... 1.pdf?dl=0

[bloke]

cool...

The F tuba is collecting dust...I only pulled it out to play Brahms - a few weeks ago (and to see if it would fit in a brown ancient California-made bag (16-1/2" bell size...NOT 18"), that I recently scrounged - left over from a trade deal).
FatBastard is getting all the petting, though I did pull out the F and the C (about a week ago) and played a couple of same-as-just-played-on-FatBastard vocalises on them - JUST to see how "confused" I might be (from reading/playing wall-to-wall B-flat).

noticed: Hey...Y'all aren't as resonant as FatBastard, but y'all sho' is easy to play.

sidebar:
Based on the tens of dozens of travel stickers on the hard case (which also was included with the same tuba) this bag has probably been on five continents: