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To insure yer tubas. Should awful things happen?

Clarion

Not super cheap, but the best and most comprehensive _replacement value_ coverage that I know of.

Clarion. Covers it everywhere.

None of the above. Insurance is a sort of legal gambling, where you bet against the house that disaster will strike. The house normally wins, of course - unless you have foreknowledge of disaster, the odds are against you. So I insure myself only where I can't afford to deal with consequences on my own. Loss of house, major illness, certain liabilities.

If I can't afford to replace a tuba, at worst, I don't play for a while. It isn't an unsustainable loss, because I'm not a pro.

S&W, combined with never buying into the bullsh!t statement: “Y’all can leave your instruments here when you go out for dinner between rehearsals; we’re locking the doors.”
(The first musician returns from dinner, and guess what happens? The door is unlocked. )

donn wrote: ↑Mon Jun 06, 2022 9:24 pm None of the above. Insurance is a sort of legal gambling, where you bet against the house that disaster will strike. The house normally wins, of course - unless you have foreknowledge of disaster, the odds are against you. So I insure myself only where I can't afford to deal with consequences on my own. Loss of house, major illness, certain liabilities.

About to engage in a weird flex, but it is what it is. During college and law school, I never paid for health insurance. Because I was invincible. No issues. Last year of law school, I figured I'll get insurance and get all my appointments in, because student insurance was cheap-ish. Six months later, $10k+ in medical bills because of appendicitis. Insurance covered it all. BIG WIN.

This past year, we had a massive plumbing issue that caused our yard to have to be excavated and pipes replaced. New yard required. New fence required. Again. $10k+ in bills. Insurance covered it all.

I don't think I have a third miracle in me.

Clarion. And at half the usual price (read: the same price union members get) by paying the nominal membership in Chamber Music America.

Rick "fully capable of destroying a tuba just by stumbling while carrying it" Denney

Floater on the Homeowners.

Was told by Clarion they don't underwrite in Florida

I'm investigating "Music Pro".

iiipopes wrote: ↑Tue Jun 07, 2022 12:40 pm Floater on the Homeowners.

Some reasons why I didn't go this route:

1) My HO policy would only pay actual value in the event of a loss; clarion would pay full replacement value (HO seems it as a property with a value; Clarion goes further, because it's meant for professionals, and you have to replace it with something similar, and in many cases, one-for-one replacement just doesn't exist.
2) My HO policy automatically disqualifies me from coverage if I earn any money at all from playing. I usually don't earn anything for playing, but it's happened a few times before.
3) Clarion covers the instrument, even if it's in possession of someone else. And they also cover costs of rentals while procuring a proper replacement or repair.
4) I don't need my entire HO policy rates to go up, because of something because of my tuba (and not my actual house).

Clarion isn't cheap, but if I ever needed it, I think it would be worth it.

tubanh84 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 07, 2022 12:11 pm

donn wrote: ↑Mon Jun 06, 2022 9:24 pm None of the above. Insurance is a sort of legal gambling, where you bet against the house that disaster will strike. The house normally wins, of course - unless you have foreknowledge of disaster, the odds are against you. So I insure myself only where I can't afford to deal with consequences on my own. Loss of house, major illness, certain liabilities.

About to engage in a weird flex, but it is what it is. During college and law school, I never paid for health insurance. Because I was invincible. No issues. Last year of law school, I figured I'll get insurance and get all my appointments in, because student insurance was cheap-ish. Six months later, $10k+ in medical bills because of appendicitis. Insurance covered it all. BIG WIN.

This past year, we had a massive plumbing issue that caused our yard to have to be excavated and pipes replaced. New yard required. New fence required. Again. $10k+ in bills. Insurance covered it all.

I don't think I have a third miracle in me.

My second son spent about a week in the hospital after birth. He was totally fine, except he was BIG (about 10 lbs) and his liver had to kind of catch up for a few days to account for his size. I forget the total of the pediatric ICU bills, but it was VERY high. We paid like $3k. What a deal! (Not sarcasm!)

For houses... Be damn sure you have either proper flood insurance, sewer backup insurance, or both. A few neighborhoods over from me, there have been TWO water main breaks in the past 2 weeks. Some people have had FEET of water in their basements, ruining everything... And this happened TWICE. But, it's not technically a "flood," so flood insurance didn't cover it. People with sewer backup riders are covered. Those without... Are not.

Also, shop around for insurance every few years. Companies have NO concept of customer loyalty. Actually, it's the opposite. If you stick with them for 20 or 30 years, they know you're not going anywhere, and your rates aren't magically going to go down. But shop around at different companies, they want your business, and will make you a better deal.

I'm cautious about ever filing a claim... It'd better be worth it, because I expect my premiums to go up after that claim. They're gonna try to get as much of that $ back from me as they can, just a liiiiiittle but at a time, for a long time. Insurance companies are in it for the long run.

Remember that old Chris Rock bit?

"They shouldn't even call it insurance.
They just should call it ''in case Shirt.''
l give a company some money
in case Shirt happens."

The purpose of insurance is to
- get paid sales commissions and premiums (as many things: Get money for nothing.)
- avoid paying claims, except a minimum amount to satisfy officials
- raise rates on those who don’t shop around after buying it

- Some of it we are coerced into purchasing (from the private sector) by officials - or by places that loan people money to buy things.
(The classical definition of this sort of thing - when the coercion to buy specifically comes from officials - is "fascism".)

- Some of it is that which we decide that we cannot afford to be without, whereby exposure could be devastating. An example for most might be automobile liability insurance. ("Collision" insurance is the type that car loan people typically coerce people into purchasing, though their logic makes sense: "If you don't have the money to buy the car, you probably don't have the money to fix it if/when you tear it up, either...and - until you pay for the car, it's OUR car.")

- Some insurance is gimmickry, and is sold, rather than sought.

A musician friend had her house invaded and ALL her instruments taken while she was ASLEEP. So it wasn't just replacing "an" instrument. It was all of them, including a very nice string bass, her Elkhart Conn 8D horn, and I don't remember what else. Some irreplaceable. I don't know what insurance she had, but I don't mind the few hundred I pay. Some instruments are not replaceable, especially strings. I also get the "less than union rate" because I'm strictly an amateur. I actually stayed in the union until a couple years ago because initially Clarion told me that was the way to get the best rate, and then found out I was getting a better rate and they never told me.

So far all insurance companies I have talked to (including clarion but not music pro... havent spoken to them yet) will only cover:

-Bill Of Sale price non-private
- An official appraisal from a reputable music company.


NOT NOT NOT the purchase price.
Which liberty mutual claims to cover.... But does not.

Now looking to get an appraisal.

Things to consider:
* how much it would cost to replace your tuba, in the event of a total loss
* the difference between THAT and the insurance payout (minus the deductible)
* if you would even WANT to replace it with the exact same thing anyway
* how much it would affect the rest of your homeowners policy rates in the event of a total loss
* how "risky" your behavior is anyway (do you live in a major city and walk/public transit to everywhere? I did in NYC for 8 years... and that was completely stressful with a $$,$$$ tuba on my back walking all over the place). If you live in a rural or suburban area and are smart and careful about your stuff, do you NEED much coverage?
* how many instruments are you covering? one? ten?

It basically all comes down to, if everything goes wrong and the tuba is a total loss, then what? Think through exactly what would happen, how long you'd be out of an instrument, how it would get replaced (for same or for different), and potential downstream effects

I don’t have mine insured at the moment. I don’t really leave them in a situation where they’ll get stolen, ran over, etc. They rarely leave my house. The one that DOES is a band-owned Besson 982. However, I’m also aware that I’m an event of an earthquake, tornado, or whatever else, I’m SOL. It’s not something that I feel like I need to pay for at this time. To echo what was said above, if I can’t afford to replace a tuba, I just won’t play for a while.

I DO, however, keep very neat documentation of my stuff. Bills of sale, many photos, dates of the transaction, when and where, etc…

I think that is something we should all do. Treat these things like they’re a vehicle in a sense. That way, you at least can prove what you paid for it, who you got it from, when you got it, and everything in between.

i just finished a conversation with my insurance guy about updating the policy... seems I AM underinsured 35%. so there we go... yet ANOTHER increase. one GOOD thing i found out though was i DON'T have to list my instruments... they're covered under a REPLACEMENT clause... that is, if they're stolen (i forgot to ask about lost... )they will replace it with one.

i used that clause 20 years ago when lightning came thru the phone lines and fried nearly $6K of electronics gear via phone modem to power strip where i had a bunch of stuff plugged in... the poor strip had a surge protector, but it didn't survive... i bought new stuff and sent them the bill.

i was thinking he told me that clause wasn't available after my last update, and asked about that, he said it was still there... i pay $50 a year for it.

so i think i'm good....

Clarion for my kids' instruments - Muramatsu, Bach Strad, Besson, Sterling. Higher risk (likelihood/impact) than our other instruments. Low cost for lots of peace of mind.
For emergency fire evac planning, my first instrument out the door is the Olds O-97 junior sousaphone. Low on-paper value, but nigh irreplaceable. Insurance wouldn't do much for me in that horn's case.