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I'm seeking help dating my Cerveny horn. It has a serial number 2195 on the bridge under the keys, and another number (28648) where the tubing from the mouthpiece attaches to the first valve. Other sources have dated it to around 1905. I'm also interested in what it is (!). Tenor horn? Euphonium? Tenor Wagner tuba? It's roughly the size of my euphoniums, and plays in the same range as them (it's a Bb instrument).

not wagner tuba for sure. those were left handed. It seems to be what most would call an oval baritone, or a tenor horn in some parts of the world

Maybe go on the tuba museum site and compare it to other Cerveny? Serial numbers on that brand don't seem to have any rhyme or reason

https://simonettitubacollection.com/

Looks like a German-style baritone to me.

jonesbrass wrote: ↑Tue Nov 21, 2023 9:24 pm Looks like a German-style baritone to me.

Which in Germany would be tenor, right?

The Germans use both, difference is mostly the bore

https://www.thomann.de/gb/onlineexpert_ ... rence.html

donn wrote: ↑Wed Nov 22, 2023 4:49 am

jonesbrass wrote: ↑Tue Nov 21, 2023 9:24 pm Looks like a German-style baritone to me.

Which in Germany would be tenor, right?

There are differences. On second look, it is more likely to be a tenor horn. Less flare in the throat and bell. Slightly different sound.

jonesbrass wrote: ↑Wed Nov 22, 2023 11:00 am

donn wrote: ↑Wed Nov 22, 2023 4:49 am

jonesbrass wrote: ↑Tue Nov 21, 2023 9:24 pm Looks like a German-style baritone to me.

Which in Germany would be tenor, right?

There are differences. On second look, it is more likely to be a tenor horn. Less flare in the throat and bell. Slightly different sound.

I agree. Looks like a tenor horn to me.

Yep. Tenorhorn, not a Bariton, but it would be safer if there were a set of both from the same series.
The horizontal main slide is something I hadn´t seen on these, yet.

Transition between Tenor and Bariton is not well defined, this is rather a question of the manufacturers´ take on the subject and related to the x/4-definitions of the tuba world.

Many companies will offer them in matching pairs (such as Melton MAT and MAB series).
A rather small pair´s Bariton might offer specs similar to a Tenorhorn of a wider-built set.


The Miraphone homepages offer good possibilities to explore these:
https://www.miraphone.de/instruments/te ... n.html?p=2
https://www.miraphone.de/instruments/baritone.html?p=4

Their Bb Kaiser- Baritons seem to be mouth watering little tenor tubas...

Many thanks for all of the tips. It seems it is indeed a tenor horn. As for the age, my earlier estimate of 1905 seems about right, though it may be older than that. Any leads on reliable Cerveny serial numbers from that era would be appreciated.