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Hi all,

I have a Schilpf #11 practice mute for sale. $200 (Paypal preferred, ideally friends and family, otherwise add $10 for fees). Shipping in the continental US included.

Selling because it was used for my Kalsion DS and is not the same size as my new to me 2155. Very good condition!

Located in the Savannah, GA area.

Please email me at pauvog90 (at) att (dot) net

Sizing chart I found online:

Gonna need one for my Yam641. Probably doesn’t fit.

The Schilpf guide says the 11 fits 6/4 horns like the Holton 345 or the MW 2165.

The Daryl Smith is very much a 4/4 tuba. I am not understanding you, here. Are you sure it is an 11 or are you calling the Kalison Pro 2000 a DS? (The Pro 2000 is the Kalison horn that the #11 fits,)

If this will properly fit my 345 or my Yamaha 826 I might be interested.

Pics?

It fit my DS perfectly and is what Lee Stofer recommended when I bought it for that horn. The mute definitely has an 11 on it.

Pauvog1 wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 5:37 am It fit my DS perfectly and is what Lee Stofer recommended when I bought it for that horn. I'm not sure if this chart is super accurate. The mute definitely has an 11 on it.

I also have an 11 that I use in my 4/4 sized Eastman 832 CC and it fits great.

the elephant wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 8:49 pm The Schilpf guide says the 11 fits 6/4 horns like the Holton 345 or the MW 2165.

The Daryl Smith is very much a 4/4 tuba. I am not understanding you, here. Are you sure it is an 11 or are you calling the Kalison Pro 2000 a DS? (The Pro 2000 is the Kalison horn that the #11 fits,)

If this will properly fit my 345 or my Yamaha 826 I might be interested.

Pics?

I will take some shortly!

Pictures

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/ ... WTGHgaiX4m

Perhaps the regular mute numbers do not match with the practice mute numbers, but according to the Schilpf document provided in the link above this is not possible. Please read the description from that Schilpf document. It lists nothing but very large tubas in the description for the #11 practice mute. It even lists the Kalison Pro 2000 and Pro 2001 (as "large", the DS having a bell throat a bit narrower than a 186). I suppose that Schilpf's documentation could have a typo, but that is a pretty specific list, and none are 4/4 tubas. I am not making this up; I am pointing it out to help clarify this discrepancy. I agree that this mute looks to be pretty small, and would not fit correctly in a 6/4 tuba bell.

Since I am looking for the one listed in the image below, does anyone know the CORRECT model number Schilpf PRACTICE mute will fit properly in the bell of a Holton 345? That is the only thing I am interested in buying, and it is disappointing that the guide on the Schilpf website is not accurate.

Thanks for the help, and good luck with the sale!

I have a “10” here (…that I never use because the results I get aren’t as good as a modified Denis Wick or an old Humes & Berg with the tubas I own…). Can’t be sure, of course, because of photo perspective, but I don’t think the mute pictured here is an “11.” I think it might not be labeled correctly. Looks too small. Base should be proportionately wider. Maybe the seller could set it in the bell of one of the current tubas they do own for size perspective. I believe the chart is correct. Sounds like these work when they fit correctly.

A big “for what it’s worth” on this one.

If one were to look inside the mute on the foam batting, there should be a number written in there. I have to rely on that when the stickers on the outside fall off.

Our size charts do state that a #11 fits the DS but I need to confirm that when another comes in the shop. And #6 is the proper practice mute size for the 832/632. The mute is designed to fit very close but not touching the bell rim. If it sticks out too far, it won't fit in the case or gig bag. It may function fine and if one is not transporting the mute, then that's ok, I guess.

I found that my Kalison Pro 2000 BBb takes a #14 with extra 3M strips to make it fit. I'm at least the third owner and the bell has been worked to remove dents. This brings up an interesting observation; the mutes have been fitted to new instruments at exhibits/shows and cataloged. If a bell has had damage and the original contour altered, a different size mute may be needed to compensate. This does make recommending a mute over the phone/email a little more difficult but I do try to remember to ask that question.

I do have a Yamaha 641 in the shop here and will determine its proper size.

Chris Hite at Buddy Rogers is the point man for Schlipf mutes in the US, but I still have my notes from when I was doing this, and I found a penned-in note in the listing for Kalison large BBb, CC, saying, "including Daryl Smith model CC."
There are many bell throat tapers out there, and the portion where a mute fits could be substantially the same on tubas considered to be 4/4, 5/4, or 6/4. Fractional sizes have been very subjective as applied to tubas. If you are looking at fractional sizes in stringed instruments, they are quite standardized, unlike tubas, and a 4/4 violin case will house basically any 4/4 violin ever made, whereas a case manufacturer has to have a fleet of cases of different dimensions to even approach all the tuba variations made.
As Chris said, if a tuba bell has been significantly dented and then repaired by being worked out, it now has a larger throat and flare and, while it may be an awesome tuba, it may require a larger size mute now. Also, due to customer input, some makers have changed bell dimensions on certain models over time, ususally increasing the size in some way. In the published list, you will note that there are two sizes listed for several popular models, and this is the reason. So, the age of the tuba may be a factor in what mute fits.
The best scenario is always to physically try the mute in the bell of the tuba, because despite all of our best guesses, putting it in the bell is the only proof-positive way to know it fits your tuba. And, as Chris said, even if the outside number tag is missing, look down through the small end of the mute, at the white insulating batting, and you will see the number written in black marker. Also note that the German "1" looks a lot like a "7" except that it does not have a hash mark through the upright portion, as a German "7" does.

MiBrassFS wrote: ↑Sat Jun 08, 2024 4:26 am I have a “10” here (…that I never use because the results I get aren’t as good as a modified Denis Wick or an old Humes & Berg with the tubas I own…). Can’t be sure, of course, because of photo perspective, but I don’t think the mute pictured here is an “11.” I think it might not be labeled correctly. Looks too small. Base should be proportionately wider. Maybe the seller could set it in the bell of one of the current tubas they do own for size perspective. I believe the chart is correct. Sounds like these work when they fit correctly.

A big “for what it’s worth” on this one.

I could take a picture of the mute in my 2155 if a potential buyer is really interested. It is dark here now, so I would wait until I could take it with some natural light present. This 11 is entirely too big to fit the 2155 bell (sticks out / doesn't work well), but the 11 fit and functioned perfectly on the DS. The DS had a pretty open "throat" at the flare but shrunk down to 4/4 (smaller than the 2155) by the bottom bow. These mutes do not go into the bell nearly as far as a traditional straight mute (much smaller than my metal Denis Wick mute).

I also just received a #5 for my 2155, and it is noticably smaller than the #11 listed. I could take a picture of the #5 next to the #11 if that is helpful.

If it is helpful for comparison / scale, I have my new #5 next to the #11. Just added to the Google folder with the other pictures.

Again, not to be repetitive (or argumentative in the slightest). I ordered the #11 over the phone from Lee several years ago. It fit / worked perfect on the DS (probably should have sold it with that horn, but didn't think about it at the time). I've never played / owned the larger 2000 or 2001 variants, so I can't comment on them / their bells. The #11 is very much too large for the 2155 and certainly too large for the MRP / pt-18p F tuba I own.

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/ ... WTGHgaiX4m


Edited to add link

The side by side of the 5 and your 11 shows a lot! Your 11 is definitely much bigger. Nothing to doubt about that!

Sizes range from -2 to 14, 17 distinct sizes in fact. And that's just the practice mutes. The Mnozil Brass Tour Mutes and Vienna Straight Mutes, along with cup models, have their own numbering system. There's a lot to keep track of.

Email sent

The Brute Squad wrote: ↑Mon Jun 10, 2024 9:40 am Email sent

Thank you, I appreciate the post. The email originally went to my spam filter. I just replied!

SOLD