The Great Kurath Re-Tubing

[the elephant]

Yes to the address, and yes to parking on the ten-foot-wide sidewalks on the narrow streets. I never saw that before except in NYC and in Europe. Here, the cops tell you to not park on the street, however, they don't seem to GAS about parking on the sidewalks. Go figure. I do both as the need arises. My neighbors on both sides and across the street (including a YC Sheriff's Deputy) all have at least one vehicle on the sidewalk, with one of them having three cars there, two on the street, and two in the driveway. (There's just two of them, so I have no idea why they have seven cars. Of course, in the back, we have four non-runners and then two up front, and there are just two of us. Hmph…)

[bloke]

There are three of us living here. Each of us has a reasonably good gas mileage car (c. 25, 30, and 35 mpg), and we also have a full-size van - for when we need to tow or haul.

There is actually a fifth vehicle that is a 2002 manual shift Chevy Prizm (Toyota Corolla, with a couple dozen non-Toyota parts). It has about a quarter of a million miles logged, and everything works - including the air.

One of my music directors has dual citizenship, and their family is parked in the country of their birth. They were renting a car here, and the rates were killing them. This car is worth more to me maintain as an emergency spare than it is to sell - though I understand that used car prices have risen. In exchange for them keeping it in good shape and insured, I loan it to them, but drive it back home and park it here when the season is over - each year… I’m getting ready to stick on an axle and some motor mounts - after the last concert of the season, because those are used up. … I warned them to not ride the clutch, but they did anyway, so - after burning it up - they replaced the clutch at their expense… still, saving themselves a ton of money vs. renting.)

…so fall, winter, and spring, there are only four vehicles here, and they all fit in the drive-through carport. The very end of the road - up into this place - circles around through the carport.

For what it’s worth, none of these cars are any newer than 2007, and they are all shoulder-shruggers. Having several inexpensive/affordable to repair/dependable cars seems to me to be a good strategy. If I had a fancy car, it wouldn’t impress Mrs. bloke, and I’m too tired to have girlfriends on the side.

[the elephant]

All our cars have well over 300,000 miles on them except for my Jeep, which has 90,000. Old cars are good cars if you take care of them.

[the elephant]

This is going to be a Seinfeld-esque post: It's a post about nothing.
_____________________________________________

"FOURTH SLIDE CIRCUIT" — There, I said it.

I have been avoiding this for a long time.

The 4rh slide circuit was monkeyed with by one of the POs of this tuba. I suspect that the two crooks were the same radius when the thing was fresh off of Herr Kurath's bench. They were not when I bought the tuba. The alignment of the big hoop was very odd, and the angle (clocking?) of the rear slide was slightly different than the later Kurath F tubas. There is a lot of homebrew-looking stuff on this, though, so it may have been a *very* early version; the lack of silver plate makes me think this horn was a test mule, and once he had hacked up everything to his satisfaction and jotted all the info down in his little book so it would be repeatable he then buffed all the mess from this tuba, did a very quickie lacquer job that was none too spiffy, marked it down and put it up for sale. It is like he made a tuba where everything looked consistent and then adjusted things as needed, then sold neatened-up versions of that tuba, but all cleaned up.

Whatever. It is interesting to ponder, but I like to daydream about other stuff.

So when I made the new 4th slides (remember, no upper one, just two lower, front and rear — I know, pretty weird) I measured the outer slide tubes and copied them exactly. The two slides had two crooks of different spans, but the leg sets were identical. One side is rather long and the other is cripplingly short. I decided to correct that slight difference by using two Miraphone 186 1st crooks since I have several old ones taking up space in a box. These match the slide tubing set I am using — no flaring tube ends to make things fit. Nice,

But no.

I mocked up the three basic parts of the 4th circuit (two slide assemblies and the big hoop) and discovered that the radius was not the badly eyeballed 5 mm that I believed it to be. It is 11 mm (which is a pretty big difference). I had already had to mangle the hoop to make the valve section removable. It has been tacked down to the top bow in a Typical European contact patch "brace" and it needed to be connected there. But there was no gap for a detachable brace. I ended p bending the hoop in a bit so that the two ends were a little "pigeon-toed". One end was straight, and one now pointed inwards a little bit. Then I bent it the other way so the ends both pointed straight down. In essence, I narrowed the span of the hoop by 1/8" to make up for how things would line up if I lifted that hoop off of the top bow by 5/16" or so. In that space, I was able to fit a modified Yamaha sousaphone screw brace. Problem solved.

Now, with the new modification of the more narrow crook, the hoop no longer clears the rear tubes of the 3rd and 1st slides
and this realization caused me to stop working for a few days because it made me mad, and I do not do this work unless I am having fun (or I have to slap a horn together for work that night — yeah, I do this all the time…) so I needed a vacation for two days of yard work. Tonight I came back, looked at my two *perfectly* aligned 4th slides to figure out which of them is the "bastard child" so that I could pull it apart and transfer the leg set to the old, wider crook. I also had to cut a new brace post that was 11 mm longer.

I thought I would be cute by trying to disassemble as little as possible, so the two brace feet stayed on the outer tubes. I removed the post and heated them enough to clean out the sockets with oiled Q-tips without them falling off or moving. Pretty slick! I also got both inner legs off without the two very short ferrules canting or otherwise shifting position so that they would not lie perfectly flat against the outer tubes.

I expanded the old crook's ends just enough to make for a firm fit and put it all together. Very good. I am pleased with how this slide works and looks.

Here are the two 4th slides. The wider one with the water key is the front one, and what I built tonight. Luckily, the other one is on the back of the tuba, so you will not notice the differences between the two crooks.


The difference in span is clearly more than 5 mm. D'OH!


Here are the two slide assemblies with that blasted hoop and the brace that must go between the hoop and the 1st slide. The upper end of the hoop is the one I bent to allow me to use the detachable brace. I did that with the tube empty.
Shhhhh… that's a sketchy practice, so don't tell anyone…

[bloke]

I sometimes drop nearly-the-bore-but-probably-won't-get-stuck dent balls down to the middle of some bows (to re-shape), and two slightly-larger-the-the-bore dent balls in either end (to yank or push without ovaling the ends), and then re-shape. That stuff takes more time that I would care to admit to.

Another hillbilly method (also somewhat time-consuming, but maybe better) is to anneal something like that, solder it (with the ends the distance apart that you need) to some old piece-of-crap bottom bow (or whatever) and pull a well-greased nearly-the-bore dent ball through with a well-greased bicycle brake cable (after also spraying the inside of the bow with something like PB Blaster).

Of course, the (play the "Dragnet" theme here) scary way is (if too wide) cut a bit out of the middle, file on the cut ends, braze it back together, and clean it up.

bloke "a hillbilly...and I done see'd yo' Armando water key"

[the elephant]

Yeah, I do all that stuff, too. Sketchy, but effective.

[bloke]

Everyone seems to bow to the ground to the holy-of-holies "mouthpipe tube".
Those things are bent in all sorts of crazy ways and (when repairing them) most are found to feature quite a few o.e.m. considerably oval areas...
...so I'm not going to freak out - all that much - about lining up non-sliding cylindrical tubing - in my hillbilly ways...as long as it "looks" good.

bloke "reminds me of people who discuss the acoustical/nodal effects of water key nipples, while - at the same time - allowing 1/8th-inch-thick chunks of sludge to form inside their valvesets."

[the elephant]

Yeah, I am over all the mouthpipe mojo people believe in. I have worked on too many trashed ones to put much stock in anything other than the basic taper rate in the first six to ten inches. The shape/bend does not matter much, soldered to the bell is actually BETTER on some horns (the two 186s, in my case, did NOT like having "lifted" leadpipes) and even dents or patches: unless the horn is *really* valuable I do not worry about it much. If I am asked to do a really fine job (ie - expensive a.f.) I will just do what needs to be done to make things whole and look good. For my own stuff, I try very hard to make it as perfect as I can — up to the point of diminishing returns.

On my Holton, I have used three different Allied pipes. They all worked just fine. I like the cheap Allied pipe. On the current one, I decided to try for a tighter first few inches, so I just cut it closer to the small end, et voila! I had a smaller leadpipe. It was still the same size at the big end, only it did not have to be adjusted to fit as much as the "bigger" (cut later in the taper) one I had on it before.

It is like any tube on the horn: dents matter, but unless they block the "airflow" (which does diddly, as it is the generated sound wave and not the flow of air that matters) more than a certain percentage they are not the end of the world. Dent-free would be much better, but not the "revolutionarily better" as some would like us to believe. When you do an A/B of leadpipes of the same size and taper, one being more or less round and the other having some pea-sized dents, they will *always* play pretty much the same if there are no leaks.

Now, if I have the time and funds, I will break my back to make a horn go together as perfectly as I am able, which is pretty good, usually, but never *perfect* per se. But if a guy wants a redneck repair (minimal PC, not even cleaned out, just "fully functional" the horn usually plays JUST AS WELL as if I had done some premium work. It is all about how it looks in the end, for a lot of people. You know, the whole "While you're in there you might as well also clean/repair/replace/yada-yada…" ethos. I will take care of everything I can, but if that is not everything, that is perfectly okay by me.

Since I greatly prefer doing very nice work (as a point of pride and not money, truthfully, meaning that I end up giving away a lot of work because it makes me happy to do so) but I am perfectly happy doing budget work if specifically asked to. However, around here I had a lot of yahoo band directors agree (as in sign papers) to an estimate. I gave them more than they agreed to, FREE WORK, and then when it came time to pay up they wanted to haggle like we were in a mercado in Juarez. I was charging them about 75% of what they actually got from me because that was the price I quoted and that they agreed to pay, then they wanted to pay me half of that because they didn't actually have that much to spend, regardless of what they promised to pay. They lied to me — or they were just being cheap jerks.

That is why I only do work for myself these days, only taking in work when begged to by a close friend. Pretty much I despise "customers" and see eBay as being a much better experience. Perhaps if I lived in an area large enough that my "good friends" were not the bulk of my patrons this would change.

[bloke]

Yes to all.
I have all sorts of levels of repair work - that I need to be able sell to various types of people - from “good“ to “mine”. If someone expects to get their stuff fixed as well as I fix my stuff, they’re going to have to pay.
I’m willing to patronize various people’s voodoo up to a point…again: as long as they pay, but - if things get too stupid – I’m going to have to let them know that they picked the wrong guy.

I suspect that most of the reason that elevated-mouthpipe tubas often don’t play as well as those with their mouthpipes soldered to the bells, might be because soldered-to-the-bell tubas are older, and might have just been made better overall…(??) when testing mouthpipes, unsoldered ones DO feel different (because they vibrate - since they are relatively small), but I do not believe that they sound different.

Something that never occurs to many players (particularly not to those who received C’s in geometry), is that - for the mouthpiece receiver to end up in the same place - an elevated mouthpipe needs to be between a half inch and an inch longer than a regular one. (Of course that extra length of capillary bore could not possibly have an effect on the tuning or sound, could it?)

[the elephant]

… unsoldered ones DO feel different…

Yes.

… do not … sound different…

Yes.

[the elephant]

The fourth valve circuit is completed. I have a ton of cleanup to do. It will take me many hours to get it all, including a few solder touchups here and there to fill a few small gaps that are not a problem but that (after all that freaking work) bug me.

[bloke]

nice symmetry … nice work

‘ funny how - quite often - things that look good also work well.

form > function

—————-
The nickel slugs went out today from “Rev. bloke” to “Bro. elephant”.

[Tubajug]

Very nice! It's coming along!

[the elephant]

I shake my fist at the Weather Gods, who hurl their thunderbolts down and send their mighty twisters to prevent me from replacing my spent acetylene tank. They threaten me with a righteous tumping by the hellaciously large, home-crushing, withered oak of my negligent, naughty, nasty, nosy, numbskulled neighbor. At any moment the Weather Gods could bring it crashing down to crush my bedroom, laundry room, and carport, exploding said B tank like well-aimed Ukrainian artillery fire. Until then I shall be dodging their thunderbolts and hiding in my bathroom with the wife and our three cats when the air raid sirens start to howl in another hour or so.

Translation: I can't work because I'm out of gas, and because of the threat of tornados I will not be exchanging the empty B tank until tomorrow.

Oh, and tornados. Again.

TTFN, ladies…

[York-aholic]

Yikes Elephant. I’ve got my fingers crossed for you!

[bloke]

A supposed tornado passed a couple of (four, maybe…??) miles west of here moving to the northeast… These are tornadoes that are seen on radar and reported by the TV dudes, but aren’t necessarily on the ground.

We got a tremendous rain with probably (??) a 60 mph wind for about two minutes as the squall line was coming through. I went out to the carport to watch. It’s open on both ends and it’s two cars wide and two cars long…no doors.

There apparently was some rotation, because the wind would blow different directions every few seconds. Part of the time I was in there. it blew straight through the carport with the rain, and it sort of reminded me of when I have seen firetrucks turn their hoses on a person or on a few people.

Should we have been in the basement? Maybe so, but it was more interesting to watch it, and to barely get out in it.

Covid (the cat) was sunken into the quilt on our bed fast asleep the entire time. This was in our bedroom which features ten approximately 6‘ x 4‘ windows which face southwest, and the storm was coming from the southwest… so there was plenty of noise. He’s a pretty chill cat.

I am aware of and remember when you had to go to the back of a fast food place because a tornado actually struck the building. The map on TV - today - was zoomed in pretty close, and if it had been showing that indicated tornado any closer, we would’ve been in the basement. We did get some power flickers. Again, it was quite a show.

tuba content: “tuba”
Oh yeah, someone did buy a tuba from me today, so I guess, “tuba, tuba”.

[the elephant]

Yeah, we were in that 1.5 miles wide "wedge" tornado in 2010. It tracked between a half-mile and two miles for 198 miles of uninterrupted ground contact. It was pretty dang bad. We were in the Wendy's when it hit and barely got into the bathroom and closed the door before the whole place blew up. My uneaten lunch is at the bottom of this pile, along with an iPhone and my wife's purse.

I had a wedding gig in Vicksburg that evening, and I was too shocked to not go. I had to drive the Jeep cross country to get around a state trooper roadblock and then a couple of miles through downed power lines and trees on a 12-foot-wide strip of power company "clear cut" (a grass road, not even dirt) until I could drive back across the railroad tracks and cross country again out to MS Hwy 3 down to Vicksburg. It pretty much sucked. Thankfully I had the Jeep and not one of the Accords. I would not have been able to make that trip in a sedan.



This will curl your toes. It is a much smaller storm. The drone footage was taken near my house in May of last year. A fun place, Yazoo City. Always something going on, doncha know…

[York-aholic]

Glad you’re okay.

[bloke]

Tornadoes are so bizarre.
My daughter, grandkids, and son-in-law were visiting from Pittsburgh a few years ago, and my son-in-law and I were pulling out a few catfish for dinner. It was sprinkling a little bit. While we were doing that, people were dying about 35 minutes straight south of here in Holly Springs.
It was just barely south of the Walmart there. The Walmart was untouched.
https://www.localmemphis.com/amp/articl ... 58e63020a3
Tornadoes sort of remind me of Memphis; you can be sitting in a Perkins eating a salad - or stopping at a convenience store buying gas/coffee, get home, turn on the news, and find out that - three blocks away - two people were being killed by gangsters at the same exact time that you were at that Perkins or at that convenience store. I guess the only difference is that tornadoes don’t happen every day.
… last comment about this off topic of off topic:
You start talking to Memphians about being constantly surrounded by violent crime…the first thing that they do is to let loose a DP “pfft”, and the second thing that they do is to recite their “Crime is everywhere” Memphitetian doxology… to which I respond, “Crime is everywhere in Memphis, but crime is not everywhere.”

[the elephant]

I got the lever rack/detachable brace installed. I'm not happy with the fit of the f=lange on the dogleg, so I will adjust that later. Most importantly, I got the rod trimmed so that there is no gap whatsoever between the threaded boss and the end of the rod, so there is zero flex or deflection when the barrel is screwed down tightly. Silver linings…

Here are some shots of me messing around with hand position and my thumb ring and pinky hook, trying to figure out how feasible it would be to use these. My grip on the horn will be much better if I can pull my thumb and pinky toward one another rather than trying to wrap them around the hoop. I tried that and pretty much hated it, but using the two hooks is much like a French horn, and it is also the grip used on an old, two-piston contrabass bugle, which is actually very comfortable. I hope this works out.

After the rod was trimmed and the keeper on the end was soldered on with the barrel in place.


The left hand's workspace — 1st slide, 2nd pull ring, and the 5th and 6th levers.


This was my Holton's previous thumb ring. It is mostly St. Pete parts. I cut the socket from a thumb ring base and silver soldered a fat Miraphone half-round lever rack mounting post to that. It is very simple and strong. The St. Pete thumb ring is actually very nice and was inexpensive back when I bought it. The lock nut comes with it, and the threaded base is not much more in cost, so this was a nice addition to the Holton back in the day. It ought to work for this pretty well, and it can be adjusted or removed without unsoldering the base.


Bach trumpet pinky ring: sturdy, well made, and I have this one on hand, so no extra money out the door.


Sort of like this, but my hand kept slipping and the heavy ring would slide downhill and rotate my hand way over to the right, as in this pic. Holding the camera one-handed and getting it focused and the pic snapped was a bear, so this photo was the best out of like six. I gave up. You get the idea, though.


Straight up is possible, but a stretch. I want to curve the levers over to make the reach more comfortable.


This is "max down" and almost where I want the lever ends to live when not depressed. I do not need them to be this far down, so perhaps halfway between these two positions will work?