6/8 marches vs. ￠marches

[bloke]

' sorry if I've already posted about this (maybe in a thread about something else)...

...but how many of your wind-band colleagues make the distinction (and or understand/notice the distinction) between playing quarter-note bass notes in ￠time marches vs. playing quarter notes in 6/8 time marches?

To me, the distinction is very important, and contributes (even more than the percussion parts) to the proper "feel" of duple meter and/vs. triple meter marches.

[Ace]

This doesn't answer your post, but I love the shift from 6/8 to 2/4 meter used by Sousa in his "El Capitan" march. It occurs between the second strain and the trio. There is a pleasant and clever feel to it.

https://youtu.be/f61GX6xeiIQ?t=62

Ace

[bloke]

This doesn't answer your post, but I love the shift from 6/8 to 2/4 meter used by Sousa in his "El Capitan" march. It occurs between the second strain and the trio. There is a pleasant and clever feel to it.

https://youtu.be/f61GX6xeiIQ?t=62

Ace

yeah...That's a really great "hook" in that march, and I enjoy it very much as well.
============================
The 6/8 vs. ￠ time thing is a note-length and volume-taper thing,
whereas 2/2 ￠ time is more "BUP - bup - BUP - bup",
the 6/8 thing is much more "BOW - bow - BOW - bow"...

yes...???

bloke "BOW...as in 'bow' after playing a piece of music"

[GC]

I've always thought that an eighth on the beat in 6/8 marches should be different from a quarter on the beat. I've also been told repeatedly over the years by conductors to play quarters the same as an eighth. A few let me make a difference when playing, but not many.

[Dan Schultz]

6/8 marches are cavalry marches. I think of the gait of a horse. Ta Da Ta Da Ta Da

[Three Valves]

“Good Christian Men Re-joy-oy-us....”

[bloke]

In 2/2 time, the quarter note fades out in time to reveal the offbeats.
In 6/8 time, the quarter note fades out in time to reveal the eighth note at the last third of the beats. Note that I used the words “fades out“, which refers to the style in which either quarter notes should he played in a typical American march - where the tuba is playing “oompahs” (and not some figure which is a “hook“, nor the “dogfight“ strain). That quarter note in 6/8 time - when executed as intended - is considerably longer than the one in 2/2 time. Certainly by the 20th century (and centuries earlier), composers were pretty darn specific about what they wrote and what they wanted. Lengths of notes meant/mean what they say - certainly by then. The only things that really cannot be completely notated are style and the subtleties of phrasing.

[DandyZ629]

You hit it on the screws. They're very different feels. I'm certainly not going to play "Stars and Stripes Forever" the same way I play "In Storm and Sunshine."

[Doc]

In 2/2 time, the quarter note fades out in time to reveal the offbeats.
In 6/8 time, the quarter note fades out in time to reveal the eighth note at the last third of the beats. Note that I used the words “fades out“, which refers to the style in which either quarter notes should he played in a typical American march - where the tuba is playing “oompahs” (and not some figure which is a “hook“, nor the “dogfight“ strain). That quarter note in 6/8 time - when executed as intended - is considerably longer than the one in 2/2 time. Certainly by the 20th century (and centuries earlier), composers were pretty darn specific about what they wrote and what they wanted. Lengths of notes meant/mean what they say - certainly by then. The only things that really cannot be completely notated are style and the subtleties of phrasing.

When I was a kid, I was told to imagine the difference between the bass line versus the break strain/dog fight/bottom part as "string bass pizzicato vs. sostenuto," and I'd be in the ball park. British marches required similar attention, although the style (note length) and feel was different, and German marches required full-bodied, but shorter and cleaner notes.

[bloke]

In 2/2 time, the quarter note fades out in time to reveal the offbeats.
In 6/8 time, the quarter note fades out in time to reveal the eighth note at the last third of the beats. Note that I used the words “fades out“, which refers to the style in which either quarter notes should he played in a typical American march - where the tuba is playing “oompahs” (and not some figure which is a “hook“, nor the “dogfight“ strain). That quarter note in 6/8 time - when executed as intended - is considerably longer than the one in 2/2 time. Certainly by the 20th century (and centuries earlier), composers were pretty darn specific about what they wrote and what they wanted. Lengths of notes meant/mean what they say - certainly by then. The only things that really cannot be completely notated are style and the subtleties of phrasing.

When I was a kid, I was told to imagine the difference between the bass line versus the break strain/dog fight/bottom part as "string bass pizzicato vs. sostenuto," and I'd be in the ball park. British marches required similar attention, although the style (note length) and feel was different, and German marches required full-bodied, but shorter and cleaner notes.

yes to all

[bloke]

...just one other thing about this:

It requires considerably more energy to play the longer notes in 6/8 time, because there is less time not playing, which means there can be a tendency to drag.

[iiipopes]

...just one other thing about this:

It requires considerably more energy to play the longer notes in 6/8 time, because there is less time not playing, which means there can be a tendency to drag.

Indeed.

[York-aholic]

This doesn't directly address the topic, but is an interesting look at "performance practice" for Sousa marches curtesy of the Pershing's Own US Army Band:

https://youtu.be/DetE5-cH6iE

[bloke]

re: WaPo March...

He is having them accent the “hook“ figure the typical way (leaning on the quarter note on beat 2), but it sounds better - and attracts more attention to the “hook” figure - to lean on the very first eighth note of the figure. I only recently discovered this myself, and always played it the way they are playing in the video.
fwiw... No accents accents nor rfz’s are notated.

[prairieboy1]

This doesn't directly address the topic, but is an interesting look at "performance practice" for Sousa marches curtesy of the Pershing's Own US Army Band:

https://youtu.be/DetE5-cH6iE

Would it be possible that Paul Bierley attended this event? Audience members were seated on the stage and those of you with better eyes than mine, please take a look at the man with a full white head of hair in the light blue shirt seated with the band and having a folder open on his lap. I believe it is his wife sitting next to him. Just a shot in the dark probably. I certainly have enjoyed anything that he had written, including "The Incredible Band of John Philip Sousa".