Learning! My Pan-American Disassembly/Reassembly Thread

[Sousaswag]

Today, I...

Began disassembly of my (POS) Pan-American tiny Eb tuba. I used (mostly) a propane torch, because the itty-bitty butane torch I purchased didn't get things hot enough. Here's what I noticed:

1) Whatever hack did work on this thing completely fubar'd the leadpipe. When I tell you it barely took any heat to get that unsoldered from the horn, it literally took NOTHING. They also cut the tube that goes into the first piston horribly, I think. It certainly doesn't look factory to me. Same thing with the 3rd valve tuning slide. It took almost nothing to get that off. In fact, it fell off without my intention.

2) The valves are toast, but the body is in surprisingly good condition. I only got up to taking one of the larger bows off, because I couldn't get the next one to move. I got the braces off, though.

3) Most of the braces are also in poor shape. Should I have marked where they go? Yes, probably. But I did not.

4) It smoked a lot. Good thing I did it in my garage.

5) Controlling your heat is a thing. I haven't quite gotten the hang of that. (It's my first day!) I know it also varies on type of torch. I used what I had.

6) It wasn't "hard" to do, but I certainly appreciate the skill it takes to do this sort of work REALLY well. Anybody can heat stuff up and pull on it until it comes off.

Tomorrow, I'm going to continue pulling things apart, and will begin cleaning everything up so I can see how these parts are going to fit together. I also got solder all over the place on the body. I'll need to address that as well. No burns today, either. Yay!

Pictures...

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You may think this looks like it's in good shape. It was not.

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Probably didn't name the bows right. I don't care, it made sense to me at the time

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Leadpipe... Yeah, someone didn't know what they were doing, or didn't care?

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Pile O' Parts! Check out those valves

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The valve set.

[bloke]

From some of the first things you posted about your first experiences, my guess is that you had the flame turned up too high.
Whether something is soldered together crappy or superbly, it takes about the same amount of time to melt solder - given the same amount of heat/flame size.

[Sousaswag]

Today, I...

Continued breaking down the tuba. I got the rest of the big bows apart with minimal effort. I'm learning to control my heat as I kept working. Today went much smoother than last time. I didn't have that much time to work today, but I'm happy with what I got accomplished.

Once I had things apart, I began cleaning up the old bracing points and tube ends. My little torch worked really well for things like this. It's not perfect, as I didn't have that much time to do it, but I got the top bow mostly cleaned up.

My biggest struggle was the bottom bow and ferrule. As the bell was coming off, the ferrule lifted up a bit, so now I need to either pull it the rest of the way, or attempt to deal with it as is, and try to get it back into place.

Cleaning the inside of the tubes was also proving to be a little more of a challenge. I did get the top bow pretty effectively, but the smaller bows with less access will again be a little more challenging.

I am going to continue cleaning up every solder joint I pulled apart. Next update, I hope that I will have the rest of the tubes cleaned up and ready to practice soldering it back together.

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Disassembled tuba.

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Top bow solder pads, mostly cleaned up.

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Really bad picture, attempting to show one of the many tube ends I'm in the process of cleaning up.

[MiBrassFS]

That’s great! Good for you! Hands-on is the best way to learn anything in the 3-D world.

[bloke]

It doesn't take too long to learn how to handle solder. When you figure out how to get it to sort of a putty stage instead of a liquid stage, you are learning a lot. That means that you're controlling and maintaining your heat within a very small temperature range.

Analogize that to playing in tune within one or two hundredths of a semitone.

Ironically, as I become less and less fascinated with doing this stuff, I get faster and faster at it (faster and faster, even at this late point in my so-called "career") and it's the same reason that other people get faster and faster at doing other types of work, because they know just what to do, just how to do it, and just when to do it. It's funny how doing things just right, making no mistakes and not having to backtrack on anything causes things to move along quite quickly.

[pompatus]

IIRC, there is a study that mentions something about expert status and 10,000 hours. There is definitely truth in skill increasing with effort invested, and I can only imagine with something like 10,000 hours on a task an individual would be proficient, at a minimum.

Keep up the effort, OP!

[Sousaswag]

Over the last week, I…

Got the body fully disassembled and got all the joints cleaned up. Now, I have everything totally dry-fit and ready to assemble when I get a better handle on the soldering aspect of this job.

I also got the rest of the valveset tubes cleaned up as well. Somebody totally butchered the leadpipe. The end that goes into the tuning slide is cut about as poorly as Holton 345 bows. I squared it up to the best of my ability. It’s fine now. This tuba will never be a player anyway.

I’ll post pics later.

[Sousaswag]

Today, I...

Got the body of the tuba soldered together. Please note, I have done *zero* clean up work to this thing. I got everything lined up, fit together as good as possible, and soldered in place. It went pretty well! I only burned myself twice.

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Additionally, I began work reassembling the valveset. I got slide tubes for all 3 valves soldered in place. Now, I just need to get the braces on, and clean up/fix up several others before the valves go back on the horn.

The most challenging thing, honestly, has been the braces. I've really been struggling to control the heat well enough to not make a mess, but also keep them in the same place the whole time. I ordered some soldering clips, they just haven't come in yet.

The other issue I ran into was that someone in the past had really bashed in the bottom bow. The tuba probably took a big fall like most of these old ones have. I rounded it out as best I could, and ultimately just stuck it together.

I did get a bunch of globs the first few joints I soldered together, but as I kept going I improved.

Again, this thing will never be a player, but I am super proud of myself for getting this far with the horn so far. Next on my list is cleaning up the body, continuing putting together and cleaning up the valveset, and then taking on all the brace cleaning and aligning to put the valves on.

[Tubajug]

Great job! The best way to learn it is to do it (says the complete home hack who is still learning plenty as I go). I did the same thing to learn. I bought a super cheap three valve Eb, took it apart, fixed what I could, and put it back together. Keep up the great work!

[York-aholic]

You watch, once put back together, it will probably play perfectly in tune. Then it will be whispering in your ear, “flip me around and make me a front action 4+1…”

[Tubajug]

You watch, once put back together, it will probably play perfectly in tune. Then it will be whispering in your ear, “flip me around and make me a front action 4+1…”

Haha! That's what I did to my current Eb! It played so nice as a three-valve, I decided to go for a full conversion.

[Sousaswag]

Ha! This little guy would need a LOT of work for something like that. Maybe someday...

Anyway, today, I got the valve section mostly completed! I still have some cleanup to do, I count two globs, but I'm really proud that I got two braces on there without huge mess or issue, as well as one of the body braces to hold those bows in place. I didn't get them all totally in-line with each other, as the brace holding 1 and 2 together was a PITA to get soldered without moving, but I did my best.

No burns today, either.

I will probably get all the braces on the outer tuning slides so the valveset can sit on the body securely to solder it in place.

Am I 100% confident I got everything sealed with no air leaks? Absolutely not! For all I know, it could play as $h!tty as it did before I did all this. I'm looking for a learning experience and any improvement I can make to this little guy.

Here's where I got it as of today. I have yet to solder the brace for the first slide tubes, but I did get it fitted in there pretty good.

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[bloke]

U go, bro.

[Sousaswag]

Okay, I got the valves ON today.

I spent several hours getting the braces fit to where they're supposed to go, again, to the best of my ability. I really should've marked what went where, but I didn't.

Why did it take so long, you ask? Well, I installed one or two in the wrong spot, then had to carefully swap them around, re-fit them, yadda yadda yadda. Eventually, I got things mostly back together. It is getting easier.

I've got a few more braces to adjust, 3 or so more to zip on, and then deal with the horrors of the mouthpipe and receiver.

NOTHING fits right, and it didn't from the time I pulled it apart. Somebody must've cut this mouthpipe, very poorly, because the end of it is completely botched. It's uneven, sharp, and just barely cracked in one place. I may wind up cutting off a tiny amount to get the thing square. I think the receiver is too big for the mouthpipe size. I believe someone took another receiver, tuba sized, and just soldered it on there. Keep in mind, none of my tuba pieces fit right, anyway, as I suspect it ran right into the beginning taper of the mouthpipe. I will try to get it fit right, or as right as it can be.